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-   -   FI with continous high speed driving 130MPH+ (http://www.the370z.com/forced-induction/63944-fi-continous-high-speed-driving-130mph.html)

conmam 12-05-2012 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPenvy (Post 2047417)
i got a uprev cable where is the option to change the value for the speed limiter?

You should call Uprev and ask Jared. It is hard for me to explain though here since I don't have my car with me. If I did, I could just run out there and open up the GUI and let u know..

FPenvy 12-05-2012 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by conmam (Post 2047471)
You should call Uprev and ask Jared. It is hard for me to explain though here since I don't have my car with me. If I did, I could just run out there and open up the GUI and let u know..

its cool bro i appreciate it. im not fully up to speed with everything in it hence why i havent tuned anything myself yet.

pwrhsms 12-06-2012 02:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coon-azz (Post 2047095)
Just because I don't have the ability to go that fast, could you do video of your next run? Just so I can enjoy it to! :tup:

I'm stuck in Afghanistan at the moment but I will def post some vids of top speed after I get this done.

Mr.Squeeze 12-06-2012 02:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elperuano (Post 2047387)
6th gear at 80 is probably around 3k rpm or more.. That's not revving high at all. What I personally would do is go wot from 4th n max out at 6th. That's how I hit 150 all the time. Shifting gears around 7k.
What Lafitte is doin is starting his run from 80 on 6th gear which is prolly little more than 3k rpm. Now to push it from top of 5th into 6th is how I would do it, but rolling start at 80 on 6th... Personally I'd use another gear. To each his own


Sounds like you nee 3.3 final drive, I start in 3 gear at 80 and end up in 5 gear by 150.

SS_Firehawk 12-06-2012 02:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pwrhsms (Post 2047669)
I'm stuck in Afghanistan at the moment but I will def post some vids of top speed after I get this done.

Which RC / FOB?

conmam 12-06-2012 03:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr.Squeeze (Post 2047676)
Sounds like you nee 3.3 final drive, I start in 3 gear at 80 and end up in 5 gear by 150.

But then your speedometer reading will be way off because factory speed sensor was made for 3.629 final drive ratio. How do we correct this issue ?

Mr.Squeeze 12-06-2012 03:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by conmam (Post 2047687)
But then your speedometer reading will be way off because factory speed sensor was made for 3.629 final drive ratio. How do we correct this issue ?


Not sure how to correct the issue people have been switching final drives on Z's for years. At my power level I need it the stock gears are just to short for my power level. My speedometer being of a little is something I am not worried about it can be thrown off just by changing tires.

conmam 12-06-2012 03:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr.Squeeze (Post 2047693)
Not sure how to correct the issue people have been switching final drives on Z's for years. At my power level I need it the stock gears are just to short for my power level. My speedometer being of a little is something I am not worried about it can be thrown off just by changing tires.

How much whp and wtq are you having on your Z ?

Mr.Squeeze 12-06-2012 03:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by conmam (Post 2047694)
How much whp and wtq are you having on your Z ?



High boost 647whp 613TQ link to my thread is in my Sig

conmam 12-06-2012 04:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr.Squeeze (Post 2047696)
High boost 647whp 613TQ link to my thread is in my Sig

Yeah. That I see . Pretty close to 700 flywheel hp. Very strong and pretty killer torque you got there. Looks like a 3.3 final drive can get you up solid over 200 mph if your aerodynamics allow you to.

By the way, how is the driveability for your high power TT set up ? Hopefully it should be as good as factory turbo on a GTR ? I mean no bogging, erratic idling issues , hard starting issues at all temperature range ?

SS_Firehawk 12-06-2012 04:57 AM

Squeeze definitely has a 200mph car. Aero is .29 cd. The GT500 is a brick in comparison, and does not make the kind of juice Squeeze is making (pun intended)

Compdoc777 12-06-2012 06:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pwrhsms (Post 2043769)
Hey guys! I have been searching for this info for the past three hours so if I missed it sorry MODS a redo thread was not intended.

OK now to business.

I live in Germany and like to drive really fast.

Even with a 24 row oil cooler and everything else stock at cruizing speeds at 130MPH my oil temps sit around 220-240.

When I open up and top out at 165mph it rides around 250-260.

I am goin to get FI this winter but my big concern is oil temps at speeds in excess of 180+.

does anyone have any advice on setup to include FI and OIL cooler parts?

Just put a fan on the oil cooler you have now. Also where did you mount the cooler? If you put it on the drivers side or left side of the car I front of the radiator and AC heat exchanger the fan for that will suck air through the cooler when the ac is on and cool the oil by 200 degrees. If you have some way to turn that fan on while the AC is off that would solve some cooling problems. Also adding a fan to the oil cooler would work as well.

Yet at those speeds it would be nice to have two coolers with fans.

I think the best would be a cooler in each side of the front wheel well with an hole cut to let air in and one out with hose that goes to cool the brakes and puller fans on both. That way the faster you drive the more cooling and even cooling when you slow down.

Mr.Squeeze 12-06-2012 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by conmam (Post 2047698)
Yeah. That I see . Pretty close to 700 flywheel hp. Very strong and pretty killer torque you got there. Looks like a 3.3 final drive can get you up solid over 200 mph if your aerodynamics allow you to.

By the way, how is the driveability for your high power TT set up ? Hopefully it should be as good as factory turbo on a GTR ? I mean no bogging, erratic idling issues , hard starting issues at all temperature range ?


If you factor in 15%-17% drivetrain lose that would put around 750 crank. I have no doubt that the car can do 200 MPH just haven't had the room to do it.

I have done 170-175 and the car get's there quick.

The driveability of the car is perfect like it came that way from the factory. The tune is spot on no erratic idling issues hard start issues. My Oil temps in the summer stayed around 180-190 W.O.T after a bunch of pulls 220.

FPenvy 12-06-2012 08:30 AM

since we are on the topic of FI and high speeds i got a good question. i was told that with my 7AT transmission and going with a TT setup i would basically lose my 6 and 7 gears. since the stress of high rpm in those gears + added hp/tq would blow everything up. this was actually my main reason for not going FI since like you all i enjoy touching my speed limiter and cruising at high speeds on the highways (especially long trips) plus the other problem is that GTM's stage 4 AT tranny is $8k with labor and still was told the higher gears may not be completely safe. :shakes head:

anyone wanna help shed some light on this? you guys seem to know a good bit about FI and high speed.

SS_Firehawk 12-06-2012 08:43 AM

I'm definitely no expert, but pushing a lot of torque on the overdrive gears, gears that are not built to handle the abuse the first few get, they may not hold up very well. My shop was hesitant to run my dyno's in 5th because they didn't want to put that extra wear on the gear. Again, I have no direct experience with the failure of the gears.

FPenvy 12-06-2012 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SS_Firehawk (Post 2047839)
I'm definitely no expert, but pushing a lot of torque on the overdrive gears, gears that are not built to handle the abuse the first few get, they may not hold up very well. My shop was hesitant to run my dyno's in 5th because they didn't want to put that extra wear on the gear. Again, I have no direct experience with the failure of the gears.

and thats where i decided maybe no FI since i like going fast lol if there was more info and tests on the GTM stg 4 tranny maybe i'd go that route. til then it's wait to get a GT-R unless i just TT my Z lol

my original goal was 550 to 600WHP but at those numbers the TQ gets up there and i'd probably blow my transmission in a week.

roy'sz 12-06-2012 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by conmam (Post 2047687)
But then your speedometer reading will be way off because factory speed sensor was made for 3.629 final drive ratio. How do we correct this issue ?

You have to change the values on the digital speed counters. Since the car is trying to read 3.629 you have to change that value to 3.3XX, also if you have changed tire sizes then you need to update that as well. I thought that this setting came with the handheld or can be done when you uprev?

LafitteZ 12-06-2012 01:02 PM

fellas I know its not optimal for me to start in 6th at 80 mph and go all the way up. Iv had my car for 2 years and iv tried things just because I can. If I were trying to get to 160 faster id start in a lower gear. I just wanted to see how it would start to pull and not stop pulling until I let off the gas. I chose to stop at 160 when i did it. With that being said I think i could redline this car in 6th gear with enuff room. Im at 540 whp on a gtm twin turbo. all stock aero besides a vented hood. the car did 160 before the turbos. I now have 200 more horses.

conmam 12-06-2012 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roy'sz (Post 2048349)
You have to change the values on the digital speed counters. Since the car is trying to read 3.629 you have to change that value to 3.3XX, also if you have changed tire sizes then you need to update that as well. I thought that this setting came with the handheld or can be done when you uprev?


Unfortunately, Uprev does not deal with BCM commands. They only deal with ECU commands. Besides that, they restrict mostly to performance parameters. Uprev cannot even do do everything that Consult III can do, unfortunately. However, Uprev is great for all your performance needs pretty much.

conmam 12-06-2012 01:23 PM

Overall, It is good to know that even a stock factory engine with about 500whp can speed up to 190 mph and won't get burn out that easily if the entire engine temperature ( including oil ) stays cool enough and as long as the engine does not knock at that load.

The VVEL is very robust as long as we keep the rpm at 7500 rpm max and make sure that it does not have any moments of oil deprivation. If the VVEL mechanism is oil starved at all, there is a very highly likely chance that it will crash sooner or later. One of the things that I must do for my car is to add the Greddy oil pan in there.

This oil pan not only adds in about 2 additional quarts of oil and cools it further, it does gave some baffle plate design that will surely help to minimize if not eliminate oil starvation during 1.4 G turns at 6000+ rpm. Cheap insurance against burning out the motor, totally worth it. I will post detail of my work once I am done with that.

conmam 12-06-2012 01:27 PM

Does anyone know a better oil pan for this VQ37 engine in the market than the Greddy one ?? All of us, please let me know if you do .......

I found AM Performance oil pan. The baffle plate design looks pretty killer and awesome but costs 1 grand. Worst than that, these AM performance people NEVER replied to my emails at all. Their telephone number in Scotts Valley, Ca is disconnected as well ......

Mitco39 12-06-2012 03:00 PM

According to my spreadsheet.

640hp - 210 mph Rev Limter Governed
500hp - 210 mph Rev Limiter Governed
450hp - 208 mph
400hp - 199 mph
350hp - 188 mph
300hp - 176 mph
280hp - 170 mph

Based on the math anyways.

FPenvy 12-06-2012 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mitco39 (Post 2048593)
According to my spreadsheet.

640hp - 210 mph Rev Limter Governed
500hp - 210 mph Rev Limiter Governed
450hp - 208 mph
400hp - 199 mph
350hp - 188 mph
300hp - 176 mph
280hp - 170 mph

Based on the math anyways.

wouldnt weight also be a factor in this or are you just setting one weight in the equation?

i mean with higher HP youre typically adding weight with engine parts, turbos, coolers, etc...

i know it may not matter since its just a simple equation for fun purposes but just a thought lol

theDreamer 12-06-2012 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mitco39 (Post 2048593)
According to my spreadsheet.

640hp - 210 mph Rev Limter Governed
500hp - 210 mph Rev Limiter Governed
450hp - 208 mph
400hp - 199 mph
350hp - 188 mph
300hp - 176 mph
280hp - 170 mph

Based on the math anyways.

Now can you do the math based on those power outputs & speeds and add distance to speed?

conmam 12-06-2012 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mitco39 (Post 2048593)
According to my spreadsheet.

640hp - 210 mph Rev Limter Governed
500hp - 210 mph Rev Limiter Governed
450hp - 208 mph
400hp - 199 mph
350hp - 188 mph
300hp - 176 mph
280hp - 170 mph

Based on the math anyways.

Yes, But has anyone ever officially and practically tested any of these numbers ? I love to know.

Also, I assume that these are rear wheel horsepower that you are stating. I am looking for about 480 - 500 reliable whp for my future FI . I can only hope to get up to 193 mph for my Z at 500whp, then I will be so much happy.

DEpointfive0 12-06-2012 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackonorange (Post 2043795)
130 mph... Jesus

:iagree: This is what I thought, and the most awesome answer:

Quote:

Originally Posted by pwrhsms (Post 2043971)
yeah cruzing and 130 and a stupid audi station wagon blows by you like you're standing still.

It kinda pisses you off when you can't match the top end of the station wagons and sedans.

Can you post videos??? How does the car feel at 165MPH?!?!?!

Honestly, you need a larger, or 2 larger oil coolers, and I'd recommend a different front bumper, maybe the Amuse, Stillen or Nismo to allow more airflow. The stock bumper blocks A LOT of the surface area of the cooling apparatuses.

Mitco39 12-06-2012 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPenvy (Post 2048600)
wouldnt weight also be a factor in this or are you just setting one weight in the equation?

i mean with higher HP youre typically adding weight with engine parts, turbos, coolers, etc...

i know it may not matter since its just a simple equation for fun purposes but just a thought lol


Take a look at the spreadsheet I put up in my thread.

These values are calculated taking into account weight (I had it set at 3300 lbs), wind resistance (assuming 0.30 CD) and the torque curve of our cars. What I did was took a stock dyno chart and then scaled it up to get the desired peak hp's. Again not entirely correct but I believe is a valid assumption as typically the TQ curves are just magnified when adding boost.


To add to my other post.

Time from 0-160
640hp = 12 s
550hp = 14.3 s
500hp = 15.85 s
450hp = 17.9 s
400hp = 20.5 s
350hp = 24.2 s
300hp = 29.7 s


Again just based on the math.

At speeds such as those weight really plays very little in determining power to overcome resistance at those speeds.

Mitco39 12-06-2012 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theDreamer (Post 2048602)
Now can you do the math based on those power outputs & speeds and add distance to speed?

http://www.the370z.com/nissan-370z-g...readsheet.html

Mitco39 12-06-2012 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by conmam (Post 2048610)
Yes, But has anyone ever officially and practically tested any of these numbers ? I love to know.

Also, I assume that these are rear wheel horsepower that you are stating. I am looking for about 480 - 500 reliable whp for my future FI . I can only hope to get up to 193 mph for my Z at 500whp, then I will be so much happy.

Yes it was all done with RWHP numbers.

FPenvy 12-06-2012 03:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DEpointfive0 (Post 2048611)
:iagree: This is what I thought, and the most awesome answer:



Can you post videos??? How does the car feel at 165MPH?!?!?!

why are people so amazed when someone puts the did 130+mph? (not directed at (not directed at poster just general question) lol i feel weird that when i say the speeds i do and get looks from other Z owners like "what didn't you know it could do that?" :bowrofl:

i hit my speed limiter a few hours after i bought mine on the 1200 mile drive home i had :tup:

FPenvy 12-06-2012 03:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mitco39 (Post 2048613)
Take a look at the spreadsheet I put up in my thread.

These values are calculated taking into account weight (I had it set at 3300 lbs), wind resistance (assuming 0.30 CD) and the torque curve of our cars. What I did was took a stock dyno chart and then scaled it up to get the desired peak hp's. Again not entirely correct but I believe is a valid assumption as typically the TQ curves are just magnified when adding boost.


At speeds such as those weight really plays very little in determining power to overcome resistance at those speeds.

ok thats cool. i cant look at it since i'm at work and dropbox is blocked due to it being a online storage type and possible viruses etc... :shakes head:

conmam 12-06-2012 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPenvy (Post 2048600)
wouldnt weight also be a factor in this or are you just setting one weight in the equation?

i mean with higher HP youre typically adding weight with engine parts, turbos, coolers, etc...

i know it may not matter since its just a simple equation for fun purposes but just a thought lol


I think the best to do is to try it out and see the real result. Like I said before on my previous post: I paid a professional driver to test out my GT3 RS MK2 for absolute top speed. The car was bone stock and had only 450 hp at the engine. Indeed, the guy topped out at ~194 mph. Now, that GT3 weighed only 3022 lbs. However, I think, but I am not 100% positive, that my GT3 had a much better aerodynamic over this stock 370Z and that's why not much hp needed in order to get up there..... and it got up there pretty strong with not much struggle.

conmam 12-06-2012 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mitco39 (Post 2048618)
Yes it was all done with RWHP numbers.

You mean someone did actually drive the vehicle and had it radar read the top velocity like what I did for my GT3 Porsche 3 years ago ?

FPenvy 12-06-2012 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by conmam (Post 2048625)

I think the best to do is to try it out and see the real result. Like I said before on my previous post: I paid a professional driver to test out my GT3 RS MK2 for absolute top speed. The car was bone stock and had only 450 hp at the engine. Indeed, the guy topped out at ~194 mph. Now, that GT3 weighed only 3022 lbs. However, I think, but I am not 100% positive, that my GT3 had a much better aerodynamic over this stock 370Z and that's why not much hp needed in order to get up there..... and it got up there pretty strong with not much struggle.

i think the GT3 is also .30 drag coefficient as well. and to be honest .30 isnt bad at all considering the GT-R is .26 and thats really good. the new lambo aventador is .33 DC so the Z is better than a lambo yea i said it lol :bowrofl:

Mitco39 12-06-2012 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by conmam (Post 2048625)

I think the best to do is to try it out and see the real result. Like I said before on my previous post: I paid a professional driver to test out my GT3 RS MK2 for absolute top speed. The car was bone stock and had only 450 hp at the engine. Indeed, the guy topped out at ~194 mph. Now, that GT3 weighed only 3022 lbs. However, I think, but I am not 100% positive, that my GT3 had a much better aerodynamic over this stock 370Z and that's why not much hp needed in order to get up there..... and it got up there pretty strong with not much struggle.

A rough estimate (using the 370z gearing) shows it would top out right in the ballpark of 198-205 mph. This is assuming it has the same 0.30Cd.

Mitco39 12-06-2012 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPenvy (Post 2048633)
i think the GT3 is also .30 drag coefficient as well. and to be honest .30 isnt bad at all considering the GT-R is .26 and thats really good. the new lambo aventador is .33 DC so the Z is better than a lambo yea i said it lol :bowrofl:

The lambo is so bad because look at all that surface that the air brushes up against, haha.

DEpointfive0 12-06-2012 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mitco39 (Post 2048593)
According to my spreadsheet.

640hp - 210 mph Rev Limter Governed
500hp - 210 mph Rev Limiter Governed
450hp - 208 mph
400hp - 199 mph
350hp - 188 mph
300hp - 176 mph
280hp - 170 mph

Based on the math anyways.

What spreadsheet? A Bugatti Veyron needs 250hp to reach 155MPH

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPenvy (Post 2048600)
wouldnt weight also be a factor in this or are you just setting one weight in the equation?

i mean with higher HP youre typically adding weight with engine parts, turbos, coolers, etc...

i know it may not matter since its just a simple equation for fun purposes but just a thought lol

I kind of agree, but at the same time, power will always trump all... The weight of a full blown turbo kit isn't going to add 500 pounds vs the 200-300 extra horsepower you'll get.

Quote:

Originally Posted by conmam (Post 2048610)
Yes, But has anyone ever officially and practically tested any of these numbers ? I love to know.

Also, I assume that these are rear wheel horsepower that you are stating. I am looking for about 480 - 500 reliable whp for my future FI . I can only hope to get up to 193 mph for my Z at 500whp, then I will be so much happy.

At speeds close to 200MPH your bigger issues SHOULD be aerodynamics, BRAKES, TIRES, and gearing... Does anyone know if the theoretical top speed of the 370Z is even 200MPH? I would assume the gearing wouldn't allow it because of how short the gears are...

Google provided me with this:
http://www.the370z.com/nissan-370z-g...tml#post247002

Again, that's just based on math... I doubt the car will go that fast though...

God bless the crazies in Germany that want to take their 370Z TO 200MPH... I wouldn't feel safe, nothing in the car is designed to go that fast

FPenvy 12-06-2012 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mitco39 (Post 2048636)
The lambo is so bad because look at all that surface that the air brushes up against, haha.

just stating facts lol i like to :stirthepot: for fun :tup:

Mitco39 12-06-2012 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DEpointfive0 (Post 2048637)
What spreadsheet? A Bugatti Veyron needs 250hp to reach 155MPH

I kind of agree, but at the same time, power will always trump all... The weight of a full blown turbo kit isn't going to add 500 pounds vs the 200-300 extra horsepower you'll get.

I posted a link to it in this thread already, but thats in the ballpark of what I figured . Take a look at it and let me know what you think.

DEpointfive0 12-06-2012 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPenvy (Post 2048619)
why are people so amazed when someone puts the did 130+mph? (not directed at (not directed at poster just general question) lol i feel weird that when i say the speeds i do and get looks from other Z owners like "what didn't you know it could do that?" :bowrofl:

i hit my speed limiter a few hours after i bought mine on the 1200 mile drive home i had :tup:


No, I know it will go that fast, and faster, I have gone 125+, but only for a short period of time, cruising at 130+, God bless Germany, lol


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