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-   -   In-House GTM Stage 2 SC Install\Tune (http://www.the370z.com/forced-induction/45287-house-gtm-stage-2-sc-install-tune.html)

Nixlimited 11-14-2011 03:49 PM

So the obvious question is why aren't the other STG 2 kits making this much WTQ? Is it a tuning preference?

Mike@GTM 11-14-2011 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nixlimited (Post 1406848)
So the obvious question is why aren't the other STG 2 kits making this much WTQ? Is it a tuning preference?

The answer to that is simple...that much wtq requires more boost and therefore a smaller pulley. We normally ship our stage 2 kits with a 92mm pulley for areas with 93 octane pump gas and 96mm pulley for areas with 91 octane pump gas. That makes for a nice 500whp 93 octane pump gas setup that isn't overly aggressive. The key there is "not overly aggressive". Unless you plan on running race gas all the time, you don't want to run too much boost.

See, with a TT kit, you can adjust boost pretty much on the fly with a boost controller. So, that allows you to fill up with high octane fuel, crank up the boost and make more power (with an appropriate tune).

On a supercharger, you would have to swap pulleys when you change from one octane to another and switch your map. It's doable, but not everyone wants to crawl under their car every time they switch back and forth between pump gas and race gas.

The idea here, is to offer a supercharger that makes good power and like our Twin Turbo kit, has more in it.

Nixlimited 11-14-2011 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike@GTM (Post 1406897)
The answer to that is simple...that much wtq requires more boost and therefore a smaller pulley. We normally ship our stage 2 kits with a 92mm pulley for areas with 93 octane pump gas and 96mm pulley for areas with 91 octane pump gas. That makes for a nice 500whp 93 octane pump gas setup that isn't overly aggressive. The key there is "not overly aggressive". Unless you plan on running race gas all the time, you don't want to run too much boost.

See, with a TT kit, you can adjust boost pretty much on the fly with a boost controller. So, that allows you to fill up with high octane fuel, crank up the boost and make more power (with an appropriate tune).

On a supercharger, you would have to swap pulleys when you change from one octane to another and switch your map. It's doable, but not everyone wants to crawl under their car every time they switch back and forth between pump gas and race gas.

The idea here, is to offer a supercharger that makes good power and like our Twin Turbo kit, has more in it.

That all makes sense, but I am looking at the 400 WTQ dyno and noticing that you are making less HP than a several other STG 2 SCs, though you are making substantially more WTQ. That's what is confusing me. Because the SC is basically linear with boost through the RPM range, I don't get how you are making so much more torque and not a ton more horsepower. Were you make 400 torque and 550+ whp, then it would seem to track your other results more closely.

Mike@GTM 11-14-2011 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nixlimited (Post 1406957)
That all makes sense, but I am looking at the 400 WTQ dyno and noticing that you are making less HP than a several other STG 2 SCs, though you are making substantially more WTQ. That's what is confusing me. Because the SC is basically linear with boost through the RPM range, I don't get how you are making so much more torque and not a ton more horsepower. Were you make 400 torque and 550+ whp, then it would seem to track your other results more closely.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike@GTM (Post 1406774)
Yes, it's possible. Here's a graph of the Stage 2 with a smaller diameter pulley making 400wtq. Notice that the pull ends at 6200rpm because we stopped the pull...we were making 14psi of boost which was more than we wanted to make. The stage 2 is a real powerhouse once you start spinning it up.

Normally, we ship the Stage 2 with a 92mm pulley that is good for 500whp on 93 octane gas. Kosstick wanted less power and got the 96mm pulley instead.

http://i313.photobucket.com/albums/l...no27000011.jpg

See the bolded section for your answer. ;)

Nixlimited 11-14-2011 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike@GTM (Post 1406975)
See the bolded section for your answer. ;)

Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhh. DUH. Sorry I missed that the first time. I was actually looking at that thinking, 6200 seems like an awfully low redline. Question indeed answered.

kosstick 11-14-2011 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike@GTM (Post 1406774)
Yes, it's possible. Here's a graph of the Stage 2 with a smaller diameter pulley making 400wtq. Notice that the pull ends at 6200rpm because we stopped the pull...we were making 14psi of boost which was more than we wanted to make. The stage 2 is a real powerhouse once you start spinning it up.

Normally, we ship the Stage 2 with a 92mm pulley that is good for 500whp on 93 octane gas. Kosstick wanted less power and got the 96mm pulley instead.

http://i313.photobucket.com/albums/l...no27000011.jpg

seems like the general increase per 1k rpm is 100 WHP just like my set up.

So this car is possibly making 530-550 whp?

Mike@GTM 11-15-2011 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nixlimited (Post 1407310)
Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhh. DUH. Sorry I missed that the first time. I was actually looking at that thinking, 6200 seems like an awfully low redline. Question indeed answered.

No problem.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kosstick (Post 1407367)
seems like the general increase per 1k rpm is 100 WHP just like my set up.

So this car is possibly making 530-550 whp?

After examining your dyno graph, you are making 75whp per 1k rpm increase.

4500 rpm -> 260whp
5500 rpm -> 335whp
6500 rpm -> 410whp

Yes, the car we were testing was making 100whp per 1k rpm increase and could have made 550whp, but we stopped the pull because it was more than we wanted to make.

NYBladeZ 11-15-2011 11:57 AM

So correct me if I'm wrong but as it stands the upper limits to the head unit at 14psi in this application is good for 550whp with the proper pulley. Meaning that if one would want to go even higher it would have to be via drop in lower compression pistons and rods.

Its safe to say that the Stage 2 kit is a beast, a user can get up to 14psi and 550whp which is more than needed for the street. 550whp and 400tq is a dream come true for any Z owner.

kosstick 11-15-2011 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike@GTM (Post 1408227)
No problem.



After examining your dyno graph, you are making 75whp per 1k rpm increase.

4500 rpm -> 260whp
5500 rpm -> 335whp
6500 rpm -> 410whp

Yes, the car we were testing was making 100whp per 1k rpm increase and could have made 550whp, but we stopped the pull because it was more than we wanted to make.

Mike, On my new dyne I think i was making 100 per 1k but i could be wrong, Seb can you post the final run with 463 / 335?

kosstick 11-15-2011 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYBladeZ (Post 1408251)
So correct me if I'm wrong but as it stands the upper limits to the head unit at 14psi in this application is good for 550whp with the proper pulley. Meaning that if one would want to go even higher it would have to be via drop in lower compression pistons and rods.

Its safe to say that the Stage 2 kit is a beast, a user can get up to 14psi and 550whp which is more than needed for the street. 550whp and 400tq is a dream come true for any Z owner.

Probably 550 WHP 430 tq

KaienZ34 11-15-2011 12:01 PM

I'd be very happy with 420whp.

Mike@GTM 11-15-2011 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYBladeZ (Post 1408251)
So correct me if I'm wrong but as it stands the upper limits to the head unit at 14psi in this application is good for 550whp with the proper pulley. Meaning that if one would want to go even higher it would have to be via drop in lower compression pistons and rods.

Its safe to say that the Stage 2 kit is a beast, a user can get up to 14psi and 550whp which is more than needed for the street. 550whp and 400tq is a dream come true for any Z owner.

We don't recommend running the stage 2 at 14 psi on a stock block with pump gas. If you are trying to get more than 500whp from the Stage 2 Supercharger kit, you're going to need more octane.

NYBladeZ 11-15-2011 03:54 PM

Don't worry Mike I won't mix up the SC capabilities with the TT, both of which are great products. I just like to get into the nitty gritty of it all. As of now I already have an oil cooler and UpRev tune so I would eventually be relying on you guys for hardware and fuel system upgrades if I don't go e85 before that. I know you guys are busy so I really appreciate the numerous responses. Keep up the good work.

Seb@SZ 11-15-2011 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kosstick (Post 1408253)
Mike, On my new dyne I think i was making 100 per 1k but i could be wrong, Seb can you post the final run with 463 / 335?

http://www.specialtyz.com/dynos/kevinlatest.jpg

KaienZ34 11-16-2011 08:44 AM

:yum: super sexy straight line....


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