Turbo 370z Supercar?
 

I always stay on top of all the new sports cars that are scheduled to be released and soon I will turbo my Z. This question is for everyone that has already installed turbo and supercharger kits. Do you now consider your Z a supercar (Lambo, Ferrari, Porsche, Corvette ZR1, R35 Gtr) or just below (Mustang GT500, Corvette Z06, BMW M3, Audi RS6). If you where at the track and anyone of these vehicles were behind or next to you, would you be concerned about being embarrassed or do you feel you would hold your own?

I think when you go forced induction on a Z it sits a little above the Gt500/m3 group and even on par with some super cars (like the Gtr) depending on what kit you buy. I definitely don't think Anyone would be embarrassed about driving a FI Z or even a stock Z.. It's a beautiful and respectable car.

From a track standpoint if your Z makes 500whp and hs the right suspension combo you should be able to hang with a Z06 around a track or possibly beat it. A GTR will destroy us around a track you can't beat the AWD.

^Agreed, but a turbo'd Z will only perform at those levels if the suspension, brakes and cooling systems have an equal amount of work invested. A supercar is not just about power, but also how efficiently and effectively it can use that power in all conditions.

When I think of "supercar" I think of rare, exotic cars which are lightweight, powerful, and with $100,000 (+) interiors. The last part more for todays supercars than that of yesteryear. Anyway, even with all that power you'd have to gut the suspension to handle all that, and at the end of the day you won't have a supercar... you'll have a race car.

To me, to be a super car, you have to start out as a super car.

+1

No way a Z will ever be a super car. It's like considering a 1000whp civic a super car. Doesn't happen.

racecar > supercar IMO

Question, if your car is faster and out handles a so called "super car" shouldn't it be considered the same?

it won't.

Agreed...you just can't turn a sports car into a super car. For a race car a Z is a pretty decent starting point though. Plus, I would much rather have a Z racecar for the track than a $200k+ supercar that would make you want to kill yourself if you get bumped.

What supercar do you think you're going to outhandle? lol...

you can put $200k into your Z and at the end of the day...its still a Z

:iagree:

Say what you will, but classification as "supercar" or "race car" at the end of the day is just classification. With enough money invested, you CAN outperform and outhandle a so-called supercar. I would rather spend 100k on my Z and make it unique and mint, and still be able to outperform a good bunch of "supercars".
But this is all my opinion. It all depends on preference. If you want a Ferrari, don't buy a Z and build it to try and be on par with one, just save up and buy a Ferrari.

If you love your z, you can build it (if you're willing and able financially) to beat what you want it to beat.

In the end, when you talk about tuning cars, the Z or any other car for that matter is just a platform. What you do to it, what it ends up being capable of is entirely up to you.

What supercar are you going to outperform with 100k in your z?

When I think supercar, I think exotic exterior/interior...its not all about performance. Even if a Z can outperform a Ferrari, its not considered in the same class as a Ferrari.

:iagree:

Surprisingly not that complex a formula. Less weight, better brakes, improved suspension, better tires, fine tuning and of course more power. A lot of the premium that goes into supercars is because of the pedigree. The fastest car at this years Goodwood Festival of Speed for example was a highly modified Toyota Celica. All things being equal though, I'd still take a slower Aston Martin over a wicked fast Celica any day.

Doesn't answer my question.

^^ this.
Like I said, it's a matter of opinion. With enough money, you can make almost any car do anything. You can be stubborn and say "no Z will ever beat any supercar", but the fact of the matter is that a civic is not in the same "classification" as a Z, but don't be surprised to see a modified one spanking you around a track. Same goes for a Z and an Aston Martin, or Ferrari, or whatever. You may never want to classify a Z as a supercar, but it CAN outperform supercars with enough investment.

There are almost not limitations in the tuner world these days. You can have a custom tranny made, swap a gtr engine forged with nice big turbos, suspension mods, stripped, nice big brakes, etc.. (you get the idea) What are you left with? A lighter, faster, smaller GTR.
What you need to understand is that cars are platforms these days.

err...ok, what do you mean by "outperform" ? Around a track? in a straight line on a strip? @ picking up hookers?

A straight line win would be the easy part..

Just an example,how about a stock Ferrari 430? I mean if a race spec RX-8 can be built to compete & win against a race spec Ferrari F430 Challenge in the Rolex Sports Car Series along with a sorts of 911's, I don't see how $100k or more into a Z wouldn't make in competative. All theortical of course since the closest version is the GS class AM Performance 370z.

Thanks for the lesson on modding cars. I had no idea it worked like that....


Problem is, we aren't in a video game, and we have to deal with platform limitations. Fact is, 100k doesn't get a z into territory where it is competitive with supercars... It barely allows for basic setup... Nothing leftover for researching new gemoetries or providing structural reinfOrcement.

100k doesn't come close to race prep costs.

Beyond that, race prep takes away all the creature comforts and the ability to drive the car on the street... Half the point of a supercar.

I honestly don't know what your trying to prove. Let's make it $300k then.

Ok. Still not streetlegal. Still has no interior. Still probably isn't on the the level of most supercars.

I don't know man... my 98 gsx would keep up with 360 modena's in a straight line all day long...
and I only spent around 12k for the car and upgrades...

in trying to turn the Z into a "supercar" you will need to completley swap out everthing that makes a Z a Z...

imo you no longer have a Z...you might as well have bought a ferrari and paid the $100k+ to mold the Z body parts onto the ferrari frame.

Straight line is nothing. I've had two cars that ran 9's. They weren't in supercar territory.

We're talking about street legal now? And interior? Geez, it's like arguing with a mule!
Put it this way: Mr. X is a billionaire. He catches a glimpse of a Z and falls in love with it. He sends it to shop Y, and says, I don't care how much it costs, make it faster around a track than a stock GTR. Or a ferrari F430. Or an aston martin.
You're gonna tell me that there is no possible way for this to be done?
I can't figure out if you're just trolling or actually this stubborn.. You asked what supercar the Z would beat around a track.. Now that you realize you were wrong, you say "Interior! Street legal!"
Please. Wake up.

You claim with $100k, your Z should be considered a supercar, since it is in supercar territory. I'm saying it won't be in supercar territory. It may be faster around track XYZ, but it is not supercar competitive.
*
To be considered a supercar, most would say a car should:
-Look good
-Have overwhelming gobs of power
-Handle extremely well
-Maintain some semblance of drivability to keep the clientele happy
-be priced accordingly.
*
A race spec Z misses out on point 4. Additionally, it fails the street legal test. If you don't care about street legality and want to go fast, a kit car might be the way to go...you could get something similar to an ariel atom fabbed up with a Z body kit for a lot less than full race prep.
*
With modification to the Z, there are a ton of platform limitations you will run into. One is engine placement. No matter what you do, the Z's weight distribution is going to be mediocre. Start talking FI or a swap and you've got even more weight up front.
*
Structurcal stiffness is another component. Just the man-hours to properly stitch weld...well, they won't be cheap.
*
*And then there is the issue of the "fat pig" nature of the Z.... the construction really prevents it*from ever being light enough to be competitive. No matter how much crap you strip out, the car won't be much under 3100 lbs loaded.
*
*

i think craftmanship come more into play with supercars...

look at cars made by Spyker....the new aileron is very similiar to the Z in performance, and without a doubt is considered a "supercar"

0-60 - 4.5
1/4 - 14.3
Weight - 3150 lbs
HP - 400
Price: $210,000

i think the build process and limited number of cars made is just as much what makes a supercar a supercar as is performance.

Oh geez, here we go again. You can throw all this useless information to try to hide the fact that your previous statement is incorrect, but it doesn't change the fact.

I will repeat myself AGAIN. "Supercar" is just a classification. My argument was NOT that it would be considered a supercar, but that it COULD beat supercars on a track.

Is that simple enough for you? Do I need to break it down even more?

Take a stock 3300lbs lamborghini Countach with 455bhp which obviously fits in your little "supercar" category, and put it on a track against a Z that has 300k invested in it.

Take a long moment and evaluate the outcome. And for god's sake be rational.

If you are unwilling to admit that a built Z can beat "supercars" of any kind around a track, then you are simple minded and this conversation is a complete waste of time.

Why not? I mean, can you honestly tell me an Ariel Atom is inferior in term of performance to a Ferrari or Aston bacause it has an engine pulled from a Civic. Different animal, I know, but its funny how people easily correlate a 4 cylinder Honda engine with being slow and utilitarian.

In hypothetical terms where money is no object, it pretty much is like modding in a video game. Supercars aren't as magical as you make it seem. They're just well developed machines designed for a specific task. Some designed better than others. I don't think anyone is doubting the details the goes into developing a supercar & speed alone isn't the only reason why people pay a premium. Its for this same reason you can't really call the LFA a success. It has all the makings of a supercar, but its still a Toyota no matter how you look at it.

Yes, the Z can reach supercar performance spec and you still end up with a Z, but so what. You can call it whatever you want, its going to be one bad *** ride.

It really comes down to driver skill. Even in my lightly modded Z on some days I'm faster than some GT3s and Ferraris in my run group. Also, I get similar lap times to when I was in my 650hp supercharged C6. Performance of the cars isn't different enough to overcome the different levels of driver skills.

Ah, the Straw man. Always a classic. :rolleyes:

Again, strawmanning, albeit less so.


There are certain platform limitations that come with each car. Sometimes it is a heavy structure, like in the case of the z. There's a reason there is so much carbon fiber in modern performance vehicles.

I dunno man. I'm pretty sure my 98 Maxima could beat any supercar you throw at it with $100k mods:rolleyes:

EDIT: Don't make me quote F&F lines.
http://images.paultan.org/images2/fast-and-furious.jpg

I drive a supercar.

You asked which supercar a built Z would beat around a track, did you not? You're making this discussion more complicated than it needs to be. Not all "supercars" are godly. There is no possible way that a built Z cannot compete (and defeat) a single supercar out there on a track.
I don't know how much more simply i can put it.

Please show me where I said that.


I've owned a car that would lap most supercars that came off a cheap platform. I'm pretty sure I know it can be done :facepalm: