Superchargers for the 370Z?

armensti · 07-31-2009, 03:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by john370z

I have a concern and would love to get some of your opinions.... GTM and Stillen offer FI kits for the 350 that offer "mild" gains in the namesake of being "safe" GTM, for $8,000 offers 50 hp and 60 ft lbs of torque. I think Stillen stage one is about the same. Am I the only one that thinks this is REALLY steep for those gains.

In my opinion if Stillen is to come out with a FI Supercharger kit, the "safe" gains would have to be at least 75 whp and over 75 ft lbs of torque. And the price should be under $7500 all done....everything needed for a proper install and tune. I mean worst case scenario! Guys at Stillen can you comment on this logic? Anything with less gains or greater price would cause me any MANY others I know to be happy with our cars power or wait and buy our next car with more power from the factory. Maybe this is just a rant....thoughts???

your right but the reason why their so expensive is because you get a CARB
supercharger and the warranty, thats about it. i dont find it reasonable to pay 7k for 75 hp and 75 trq

if you think about it your spending 7000 dollars so shouldnt you get at least 150-200 hp?

tt kits should go for 5-6k (if it gives you 300-350hp) but superchargers should go for 3-4k (if it gives you 200-250hp) that would be a reasonable price for me.

another thing is it would be the first supercharger out so there is no doubt that its going to cost an arm and a leg.

Lug · 07-31-2009, 02:42 PM

In both super and turbo charger kits, the price is not directly related to power produced. i.e. it doesn't cost double to double the gained HP. The money to get in at a lower "safe" hp is almost as much as going hi order because much of the cost is the same. For example, simply changing pully size gets big HP gains on a supercharger so to relate the price to the gains doesn't make sense from the component side of the equation.

Buddy Revell · 08-06-2009, 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josh@STILLEN

I can't comment.. but I can say that I think you'll be happy..

But keep in mind.. we sold ALMOST NO stage 1 supercharger kits. That was a non-intercooled kit, and was purely for price. We didn't even offer them for later flavors of the VQ35.

We'll have more details soon.. and the goal is all of the additional benefits.. CARB approval.. engine warranty.. bolt-on reliability.. all the good stuff.

Are you allowed to post some pics of the system? That would be great.

john370z · 08-12-2009, 10:59 AM

If you look at many of the big product hits in the past few years (ie, iphone, iphone 3g, 2010 camaro, M3, xbox 360, PS2, 370z, etc) they all had something in common. The customer new more or less what it did, how much it was going to cost, and when it was going to be purchasable. I don't mean to be a whiner but I would love a roots style supercharger but if I don't know what kind of output Stillen or others will make, how much it will cost, and most importantly when it will be available, I, and a VERY many others will find another place in this tough economy to put their thousands of dollars. I am not asking Stillen and others to "let the cat out of the bag", but I think it would be reasonable and still enticing to give a HP and TQ range that is achievable, rough date of release, and rough price. And of course disclose this with the chance that variables can cause these numbers to change. For what it is worth for those reading this, if you are thinking I might me full of crap. I own three successful businesses and am considered by many to be a marketing expert. I would love to hear from you at Stillen. Thanks
John

modme · 08-12-2009, 12:20 PM

^ I totally agree with the previous post. If you have an excellent product prepared, let us know the numbers and specs. That way we can start saving up money for it.

wstar · 08-12-2009, 01:39 PM

Just to counterpoint the above:

1) The products you mentioned are whole products designed from scratch. The designers can do anything they want with a new product like that, so long as it makes sense for profitability of the product (or in some cases, ahem xbox360/ps2, so long as you can hope to rape a profit on the games by selling the unit at a loss, but I digress). So they get to design to a given final spec up-front without many questions as to whether it's possible.

This is very different from designing an add-on part for a car, where lots of issues are out of your control design-wise, and you just have to see what you can or can't make work during engineering and testing, and then see what ultimate numbers you come up with at that point ($$, hps gains, etc) and report them.

2) For many of the items you listed above, the mfg actually stayed quite tight-lipped about any real details (in some cases, even the existence of the product) right up until launch time. The information the public got was initially largely through analysts' speculations, employee leaks, and the rumor mill. Eventually there's usually a phase just before product launch where they send test units to reviewers and have them sign an NDA that states exactly which details they can release and when, but by that point the design phase is pretty much done. Virtually nobody releases public details while the design phase is still ongoing.

If you want some rough idea of what Stillen is likely to produce, I would recommend looking at the publicly available data on their website for the existing VQ35 supercharger kits they've produced. We have no idea if the new VQ37VHR kits will be very similar to this (there could have been massive design changes perhaps), but even if that's the case, I would imagine they're aiming for similar price and/or performance goals to their past kits, so it does give you a little perspective on what to expect.

john370z · 08-12-2009, 07:15 PM

I appreciate your intelligent response to my questions. IMO Stillen and others should be far enough to give rough estimates of the gains, costs and final price. If they are not that far then it would be nice to hear then that they are a year or so away and just be honest with us. IMO the stillen roots supercharger shows a large range (3 stages) going from poor to respectable gains for the 350z kits. If that range is the same for the 370 then they could say so. I suppose my largest gripe is that there is no information being "leaked"(usually intentionally by the company) and I and others should not be left to wait for an unknown period of time and it is through my experience Stillen would benefit from letting us know what we can hope for, expect, get excited for and save up for in a time period. Maybe Stillen is many months away and it is in their best interest to say nothing. That way they don't loose everyone by saying they are a year away.
I feel like a mushroom...being fed $hit and kept in the dark...

Josh@STILLEN · 08-12-2009, 07:42 PM

I can appreciate the fact that you're looking for detailed information, power gains, etc. I know that's common amongst other companies pushing product without testing, especially in the turbo kit world. As they have anything running, they are quick to get it onto a dyno, and start large buzz campaigns, etc. We understand that can be huge in the world of getting people excited, and creating intent.

STILLEN operates differently in regards to forced induction, as the kits we develop always go through a rigorous R&D and testing process, costing analysis, market research and as with previous kits, CARB testing and approval, even to the point of securing engine warranties on the VQ35 kits.

I apologize we have not released detailed information, but know that it is being worked on here, and as all of the final testing and particulars are closer to the actual production version, we'll be talking about them more.

No intentions of making you feel like a mushroom on our end..

RCZ · 08-12-2009, 10:48 PM

Hey Josh can I get the first kit

Whichever one makes the most power...ok now forget carb and make it more powerful...ok then send it

john370z · 08-13-2009, 12:20 AM

Josh,

Thanks for the response and input. I look forward to hearing and seeing what you are able to put together over there at Stilen!
John

Josh@STILLEN · 08-13-2009, 12:31 AM

Thanks John! Trust me I'll be the one standing in front of Steve's office looking for the go ahead to release details. This is a perfect platform for a strong supercharger system.

We're all very excited.

john370z · 08-22-2009, 01:45 PM

Throw me a bone here!!! Is there any info out there???

Equinox · 08-22-2009, 06:38 PM

I'd be interested to see the 370z Supercharger kit myself. To be honest though, I wouldn't be happy without atleast 450whp. I might be asking a lot, but I own an LS2 and an LS3 :P

JoeD · 08-22-2009, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Equinox

I might be asking a lot, but I own an LS2 and an LS3 :P

With a supercharger and full bolt-ons, I'd say a 370Z should do a decent job keeping up with a stock '08+ Corvette.

racerxj17 · 08-22-2009, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeD

With a supercharger and full bolt-ons, I'd say a 370Z should do a decent job keeping up with a stock '08+ Corvette.

seriously? lol........

i would hope they would walk a stock vette supercharged. the base vettes are only pulling high 12's, where the lowest we have seen STOCK is a 13.1 from the 370z. i stayed door to door with a new m3 coupe up to 105 mph and neither pulled. i would call b.s, but i was there! lol

07-31-2009, 02:42 PM	#197 (permalink)
Lug A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Texas Posts: 1,926 Drives: 2006 350Z Rep Power: 19	In both super and turbo charger kits, the price is not directly related to power produced. i.e. it doesn't cost double to double the gained HP. The money to get in at a lower "safe" hp is almost as much as going hi order because much of the cost is the same. For example, simply changing pully size gets big HP gains on a supercharger so to relate the price to the gains doesn't make sense from the component side of the equation. __________________ keep Chubbs in your pocket - Chubbs

08-12-2009, 10:59 AM	#199 (permalink)
john370z Base Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: new mexico Posts: 141 Drives: 2007 335i coupe Rep Power: 283	If you look at many of the big product hits in the past few years (ie, iphone, iphone 3g, 2010 camaro, M3, xbox 360, PS2, 370z, etc) they all had something in common. The customer new more or less what it did, how much it was going to cost, and when it was going to be purchasable. I don't mean to be a whiner but I would love a roots style supercharger but if I don't know what kind of output Stillen or others will make, how much it will cost, and most importantly when it will be available, I, and a VERY many others will find another place in this tough economy to put their thousands of dollars. I am not asking Stillen and others to "let the cat out of the bag", but I think it would be reasonable and still enticing to give a HP and TQ range that is achievable, rough date of release, and rough price. And of course disclose this with the chance that variables can cause these numbers to change. For what it is worth for those reading this, if you are thinking I might me full of crap. I own three successful businesses and am considered by many to be a marketing expert. I would love to hear from you at Stillen. Thanks John __________________ 2009 370Z, Had Berk HFC and un-installed them cuz too noisy!, Stillen CBE, 10mm rear wheel spacer, K&N drop in filters. Blower to come...

08-12-2009, 01:39 PM	#201 (permalink)
wstar A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 4,024 Drives: too slow Rep Power: 3594	Just to counterpoint the above: 1) The products you mentioned are whole products designed from scratch. The designers can do anything they want with a new product like that, so long as it makes sense for profitability of the product (or in some cases, ahem xbox360/ps2, so long as you can hope to rape a profit on the games by selling the unit at a loss, but I digress). So they get to design to a given final spec up-front without many questions as to whether it's possible. This is very different from designing an add-on part for a car, where lots of issues are out of your control design-wise, and you just have to see what you can or can't make work during engineering and testing, and then see what ultimate numbers you come up with at that point ($$, hps gains, etc) and report them. 2) For many of the items you listed above, the mfg actually stayed quite tight-lipped about any real details (in some cases, even the existence of the product) right up until launch time. The information the public got was initially largely through analysts' speculations, employee leaks, and the rumor mill. Eventually there's usually a phase just before product launch where they send test units to reviewers and have them sign an NDA that states exactly which details they can release and when, but by that point the design phase is pretty much done. Virtually nobody releases public details while the design phase is still ongoing. If you want some rough idea of what Stillen is likely to produce, I would recommend looking at the publicly available data on their website for the existing VQ35 supercharger kits they've produced. We have no idea if the new VQ37VHR kits will be very similar to this (there could have been massive design changes perhaps), but even if that's the case, I would imagine they're aiming for similar price and/or performance goals to their past kits, so it does give you a little perspective on what to expect. __________________ 7AT Track Car! Journal thread / Car setup details

08-12-2009, 07:15 PM	#202 (permalink)
john370z Base Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: new mexico Posts: 141 Drives: 2007 335i coupe Rep Power: 283	I appreciate your intelligent response to my questions. IMO Stillen and others should be far enough to give rough estimates of the gains, costs and final price. If they are not that far then it would be nice to hear then that they are a year or so away and just be honest with us. IMO the stillen roots supercharger shows a large range (3 stages) going from poor to respectable gains for the 350z kits. If that range is the same for the 370 then they could say so. I suppose my largest gripe is that there is no information being "leaked"(usually intentionally by the company) and I and others should not be left to wait for an unknown period of time and it is through my experience Stillen would benefit from letting us know what we can hope for, expect, get excited for and save up for in a time period. Maybe Stillen is many months away and it is in their best interest to say nothing. That way they don't loose everyone by saying they are a year away. I feel like a mushroom...being fed $hit and kept in the dark... __________________ 2009 370Z, Had Berk HFC and un-installed them cuz too noisy!, Stillen CBE, 10mm rear wheel spacer, K&N drop in filters. Blower to come...

08-13-2009, 12:20 AM	#205 (permalink)
john370z Base Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: new mexico Posts: 141 Drives: 2007 335i coupe Rep Power: 283	Josh, Thanks for the response and input. I look forward to hearing and seeing what you are able to put together over there at Stilen! John __________________ 2009 370Z, Had Berk HFC and un-installed them cuz too noisy!, Stillen CBE, 10mm rear wheel spacer, K&N drop in filters. Blower to come...

08-12-2009, 12:20 PM	#200 (permalink)
modme Enthusiast Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: NY Posts: 345 Drives: G37 Rep Power: 16	^ I totally agree with the previous post. If you have an excellent product prepared, let us know the numbers and specs. That way we can start saving up money for it.

08-12-2009, 07:42 PM	#203 (permalink)
Josh@STILLEN The370Z.com Sponsor Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Costa Mesa, CA Posts: 1,197 Drives: 2004 G35 Coupe 6MT Rep Power: 533	I can appreciate the fact that you're looking for detailed information, power gains, etc. I know that's common amongst other companies pushing product without testing, especially in the turbo kit world. As they have anything running, they are quick to get it onto a dyno, and start large buzz campaigns, etc. We understand that can be huge in the world of getting people excited, and creating intent. STILLEN operates differently in regards to forced induction, as the kits we develop always go through a rigorous R&D and testing process, costing analysis, market research and as with previous kits, CARB testing and approval, even to the point of securing engine warranties on the VQ35 kits. I apologize we have not released detailed information, but know that it is being worked on here, and as all of the final testing and particulars are closer to the actual production version, we'll be talking about them more. No intentions of making you feel like a mushroom on our end..

08-12-2009, 10:48 PM	#204 (permalink)
RCZ A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Miami Posts: 6,403 Drives: '09 370Z Rep Power: 1119	Hey Josh can I get the first kit Whichever one makes the most power...ok now forget carb and make it more powerful...ok then send it

08-13-2009, 12:31 AM	#206 (permalink)
Josh@STILLEN The370Z.com Sponsor Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Costa Mesa, CA Posts: 1,197 Drives: 2004 G35 Coupe 6MT Rep Power: 533	Thanks John! Trust me I'll be the one standing in front of Steve's office looking for the go ahead to release details. This is a perfect platform for a strong supercharger system. We're all very excited.

08-22-2009, 01:45 PM	#207 (permalink)
john370z Base Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: new mexico Posts: 141 Drives: 2007 335i coupe Rep Power: 283	Throw me a bone here!!! Is there any info out there??? __________________ 2009 370Z, Had Berk HFC and un-installed them cuz too noisy!, Stillen CBE, 10mm rear wheel spacer, K&N drop in filters. Blower to come...

08-22-2009, 06:38 PM	#208 (permalink)
Equinox Track Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Beaumont, TX Posts: 685 Drives: 06 Porsche Carrera S Rep Power: 18	I'd be interested to see the 370z Supercharger kit myself. To be honest though, I wouldn't be happy without atleast 450whp. I might be asking a lot, but I own an LS2 and an LS3 :P __________________ Check out my Albums '13 Subaru WRX STi \| '06 Porsche 911 Carrera S (SOLD) \| '96 Mazda RX-7 6.0L V8 RHD (SOLD) \| '09 Nissan Nismo #0058 (SOLD)