A2A Supercharged Intake Options

takemorepills · 11-06-2019, 08:23 PM

The air intake of this SC is keeping me hesitant to buy this SC kit.

Could a person just hack the front radiator support to get a more open shot to the SC intake?

From what I see, there may not be much more that can be hacked in Post #10. Can't tell for sure, but looks like there is some material to be cut right next to the radiator/condenser....

TopgunZ · 11-06-2019, 09:50 PM

A solution is coming out soon, with other goodies.

Senna-F1 · 11-06-2019, 10:16 PM

Do not let the filter stop you. Changes are coming, but even without them, the kits make great economical power.

turtle64b · 11-07-2019, 08:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by takemorepills

The air intake of this SC is keeping me hesitant to buy this SC kit.

Could a person just hack the front radiator support to get a more open shot to the SC intake?

From what I see, there may not be much more that can be hacked in Post #10. Can't tell for sure, but looks like there is some material to be cut right next to the radiator/condenser....

I agree with Senna, don't let the intake stop you! I cut a bit away and did my own intake, as you can see from the pictures (Post 10 of this thread). I am working on finishing it still, but it seems pretty "janky", even though it won't look bad. The stock, non-Nismo bumper cover doesn't like an air filter of that size right there though, so it feels weird putting everything back together.

Bewhitey, another forum dude, 3D printed and posted the blueprints for an intake option, along with part numbers, so there's another option. His option required a little more cutting than I was comfortable with, which is whyI worked on my own solution. Follow this link: Topgunz - air to air upgrade

Optimiser worked wit a shop for his option (Post 3 of this thread)

There would be a solution by the time your filter got dirty enough to make a real difference, in my opinion. I haven't seen anyone do a "before and after cleaning" post or anything like that. I wouldn't be expecting dyno, but pressures would be nice.

Senna-F1 · 11-13-2019, 07:09 PM

My plan once I can get in there, is to go for a FULL 4" to 3.5" at the supercharger inlet, or at least a full 3.5" intake. The plan is to hollow out the hole as much as possible so that its surface area (which is in the shape of a rectangle) is equivalent to 3.5"/4" diameter circle with smooth transitions to 4" or 3.5" circle at each end... ready for an elbow or filter, with one extra something special. This is a rough idea of the most critical part. Will be using my 3D printer. PLA or NYLON with silicone couplers/sheets and steel zip ties for connecting the rectangular sections.

TBatt · 11-14-2019, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by turtle64b

Rough look at some comparison logs and where I'm at currently with setup yields very promising results.

Topz says that I should be getting 15-16 psi with my setup (he's seen more results from his kit than I have, so I trust him on this). Setup is Si impeller, 9 psi pulley serp-side, and 3.15-3.00 high traction pulleys SC-side.

Filter off datalogging netted me about 12 psi @ 6200 RPM
OLD filter on datalogging netted me 5 psi @ 6200 RPM
NEW intake setup datalogging netted me 10.5 psi @ 5600 RPM

I can't find evidence of tubing collapse in the recent logs, but I thought I saw it, so I immediately eased off the throttle.

Have you thought of using a spring inside the silicone tube? It works great with radiator hoses to keep them from collapsing.

turtle64b · 11-15-2019, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TBatt

Have you thought of using a spring inside the silicone tube? It works great with radiator hoses to keep them from collapsing.

I did think about that, but I was scared that the spring may come loose if jostled, so I shied away from it. That was me thinking of a traditional spring though. The PVC looks to be doing its job of keeping the tube from collapsing, so I may be finished! I've cut another piece of PVC to put between the SC and the pass-through rectangular portion if I feel like I need to.

Senna-F1 · 12-08-2019, 09:12 PM

Turtle, how are things coming along, and what’s the size of your air filter. Mine showed up today. Here’s a quick shot with a 4” pvc pipe going into a 6” wide velocity stack

turtle64b · 12-09-2019, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Senna-F1

Turtle, how are things coming along, and what’s the size of your air filter. Mine showed up today. Here’s a quick shot with a 4” pvc pipe going into a 6” wide velocity stack

Whew, that's big! haha. You might have trouble getting that to fit behind the bumper.

Things are going fine. I need to reinforce the area between the rectangular pass-through and the SC. I am getting tube collapse around 10 psi, so I hope that this will correct that. I attempted to epoxy the silicone tube to the side of the radiator support, but it seems to either have failed or not held at all. I am also interested in what Topgunz is doing with that transition piece. I think that piece will solve all the issues. I hope to get more support in there Friday.

Senna-F1 · 12-09-2019, 09:04 PM

Yep, it's big. I could actually go bigger I think. I have a Nismo bumper, and I've already gotten this setup test fitted with the bumper on. Topgunz said his design does not require any support removal, which if it uses a round tube, is going to limit the size of the tube/pipe. I've also seen the filter used and also the pipe in the picture posted. I'm sure it will be fine for most folks and quality and installation will be easier for folks. For my project, I wanted something different. A full 4" intake with massive filter and velocity stack, so that's the route I am taking. Unlike a turbo, an SC cannot work harder to make up for intake restrictions, like a bad intake/filter design. So, the easier it is to suck in the air, the more power it will make.

I have an idea for you, that I may use on my parts too. Coat your intake parts with truck bed liner. That might give them enough stiffness to prevent collapse, assuming it can get a good hold on the outside of your pipe, which might be a problem now that I think about it. In my case, it will add toughness and help to keep the 3D parts from breaking up and coming apart.

Do you know how/or if possible, to remove just the Supercharger and pulleys on the backside? Looking for room to slide stuff in the hole from that side of it.

Senna-F1 · 12-18-2019, 11:11 PM

I was finally able to put something together and test my 4” intake. I haven’t inspected my logs, but boost gauge peaked at over 14 psi. 14.1 and I think I saw 14.6 too. This is on the stock kit, also with motordyne headers. It was 35 degrees and 470’ above sea level.

EDIT:

Looking at one 3rd gear pull I hit ~14.8 / 14.9 psi at 6688 RPM!

I guess I’ll call this the Big Black Python intake.

Senna-F1 · 12-19-2019, 09:28 PM

So Eugene says boost should continue to climb even past 15 psi at 6600. Might be something going on. It slowly drops after that instead. So, anyone ever seen a stock pulley setup continue on past 15? It looks like it could just be this SC running out of steam and not being able to supply a continuous 15 psi as revs increase past 6600 on the stock pulley. But Eugene doesn’t think so. Thoughts?

BTW, Does the rate of pressure loss, as seen in the video below, seem reasonable? I had read this rate of loss is OK. I addressed any obvious leaks, except for a bit coming from the MAF sensors.

https://youtu.be/-7ZPmLl_7xI

turtle64b · 12-20-2019, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Senna-F1

So Eugene says boost should continue to climb even past 15 psi at 6600. Might be something going on. It slowly drops after that instead. So, anyone ever seen a stock pulley setup continue on past 15? It looks like it could just be this SC running out of steam and not being able to supply a continuous 15 psi as revs increase past 6600 on the stock pulley. But Eugene doesn’t think so. Thoughts?

BTW, Does the rate of pressure loss, as seen in the video below, seem reasonable? I had read this rate of loss is OK. I addressed any obvious leaks, except for a bit coming from the MAF sensors.

https://youtu.be/-7ZPmLl_7xI

In my opinion, I think that you lose efficiency and may have air escaping once you get past a certain speed. I see the same thing in my logs, where boost peaks and then tapers off at top end, around 7kish RPM

Senna-F1 · 12-20-2019, 08:37 PM

Yeah, mine used to taper, or not rise as fast. But now after 15 psi, it very slowly drops. Given my boost pressure test to 20 psi, I’m probably not leaking much. There really isn’t anything that could collapse. I’m already at 80 duty cycle and I over purchased for all my fuel components. 485 pump, S1.SE with the new rails, and 1050x that was supposed to be good for well over 600 WHP. Should have gone for 1300s, but no one indicated I’d need that. In fact I have the same components as the Topgunz ACE kit car. I’m on pump and have already hit 80%. It breathes very easily now with a 4” intake I guess.

turtle64b · 12-22-2019, 10:11 AM

Since no one wants to buy the fuel pump assembly that I accidentally bought back at the beginning of the year, I am toying with making a custom harness and putting an OEM (maybe upgrade the pump later) fuel pump assembly behind the driver's seat. This would both combat the fuel starvation issue as well as provide more flow. But that's for a different thread haha. I'm currently with CJM S1-SE with an Aeromotive 340lph and ID1050x.

I definitely think that you are going to get maximum flow with the 4" intake. The reason I didn't go higher than 3.5" is because the manifold pressure with the 3.5 setup is so closely resembled the filterless datalogging that I did earlier in the year after initial installation on this car. I should research the science behind velocity stacking, since that may aid in suction efficiency, which led to the higher pressures you see.

11-06-2019, 09:50 PM	#17 (permalink)
TopgunZ A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Minneapolis Posts: 2,651 Drives: 06 350Z , 09 370Z MT Rep Power: 6834	A solution is coming out soon, with other goodies. WhiskeyHotel, BOLIO 671, JARblue and 6 others like this. __________________ ROTREX SUPERCHARGER TUNER KITS - $6799/ CUSTOM STILLEN AIR TO AIR KITS -$2100/ 700+ WHP!! WWW.TOPGUNSPEEDWORKS.COM

11-06-2019, 10:16 PM	#18 (permalink)
Senna-F1 Enthusiast Member Join Date: Jun 2016 Location: Cary, NC Age: 54 Posts: 425 Drives: 370SC,EliseSC,MR2T Rep Power: 50	Do not let the filter stop you. Changes are coming, but even without them, the kits make great economical power. WhiskeyHotel and takemorepills like this.

12-09-2019, 09:04 PM	#25 (permalink)
Senna-F1 Enthusiast Member Join Date: Jun 2016 Location: Cary, NC Age: 54 Posts: 425 Drives: 370SC,EliseSC,MR2T Rep Power: 50	Yep, it's big. I could actually go bigger I think. I have a Nismo bumper, and I've already gotten this setup test fitted with the bumper on. Topgunz said his design does not require any support removal, which if it uses a round tube, is going to limit the size of the tube/pipe. I've also seen the filter used and also the pipe in the picture posted. I'm sure it will be fine for most folks and quality and installation will be easier for folks. For my project, I wanted something different. A full 4" intake with massive filter and velocity stack, so that's the route I am taking. Unlike a turbo, an SC cannot work harder to make up for intake restrictions, like a bad intake/filter design. So, the easier it is to suck in the air, the more power it will make. I have an idea for you, that I may use on my parts too. Coat your intake parts with truck bed liner. That might give them enough stiffness to prevent collapse, assuming it can get a good hold on the outside of your pipe, which might be a problem now that I think about it. In my case, it will add toughness and help to keep the 3D parts from breaking up and coming apart. Do you know how/or if possible, to remove just the Supercharger and pulleys on the backside? Looking for room to slide stuff in the hole from that side of it. Last edited by Senna-F1; 12-10-2019 at 02:43 AM.

12-20-2019, 08:37 PM	#29 (permalink)
Senna-F1 Enthusiast Member Join Date: Jun 2016 Location: Cary, NC Age: 54 Posts: 425 Drives: 370SC,EliseSC,MR2T Rep Power: 50	Yeah, mine used to taper, or not rise as fast. But now after 15 psi, it very slowly drops. Given my boost pressure test to 20 psi, I’m probably not leaking much. There really isn’t anything that could collapse. I’m already at 80 duty cycle and I over purchased for all my fuel components. 485 pump, S1.SE with the new rails, and 1050x that was supposed to be good for well over 600 WHP. Should have gone for 1300s, but no one indicated I’d need that. In fact I have the same components as the Topgunz ACE kit car. I’m on pump and have already hit 80%. It breathes very easily now with a 4” intake I guess. TBatt and turtle64b like this.

12-22-2019, 10:11 AM	#30 (permalink)
turtle64b Track Member Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Granbury, TX Posts: 550 Drives: '11 SC Blue 7AT Rep Power: 3366	Since no one wants to buy the fuel pump assembly that I accidentally bought back at the beginning of the year, I am toying with making a custom harness and putting an OEM (maybe upgrade the pump later) fuel pump assembly behind the driver's seat. This would both combat the fuel starvation issue as well as provide more flow. But that's for a different thread haha. I'm currently with CJM S1-SE with an Aeromotive 340lph and ID1050x. I definitely think that you are going to get maximum flow with the 4" intake. The reason I didn't go higher than 3.5" is because the manifold pressure with the 3.5 setup is so closely resembled the filterless datalogging that I did earlier in the year after initial installation on this car. I should research the science behind velocity stacking, since that may aid in suction efficiency, which led to the higher pressures you see. "Z"en likes this.

11-06-2019, 08:23 PM	#16 (permalink)
takemorepills Base Member Join Date: Apr 2019 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 196 Drives: Q60 3.7 AWD Rep Power: 6716	The air intake of this SC is keeping me hesitant to buy this SC kit. Could a person just hack the front radiator support to get a more open shot to the SC intake? From what I see, there may not be much more that can be hacked in Post #10. Can't tell for sure, but looks like there is some material to be cut right next to the radiator/condenser....

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