Fast Intentions Stage 2 TT build by MA-Motorsports.

Spooler · 03-12-2018, 10:49 PM

Common Piston Failures.

Elmo370z · 03-13-2018, 02:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spooler

Carrillo Rod failures.

What a great video. Learned something new, now I have question I can ask

jchammond · 03-13-2018, 08:10 AM

Yeah, good videos.
A question that I have (and probably tight lip info per engine builder) is ring gap setting.
As the oem VQ37VHR has a ring gap of .0091” on 1st & 2nd ring.
As the VQ isn’t normally boosted & looking over boosted recommendations of similar engines, such as a VR38DETT, ring gap setting on e85 is (bore x .005) 1st & second rings- up to 15lb boost & (bore x .006) 15-30lb. That’s (.018-.022) on 1st & 2nd rings.
Make you wonder how boosting stock bottom ends & making big power over long periods of time is capable...engine must be very forgiving.

Spooler · 03-13-2018, 08:38 AM

I am looking for info on a closed deck block. The benefits and pitfalls. Maybe I can find something good here also.

Hotrodz · 03-13-2018, 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spooler

I am looking for info on a closed deck block. The benefits and pitfalls. Maybe I can find something good here also.

There are few good videos on line. I did a search a couple of years ago. If nothing else there is a reason GTR motors are closed deck from the factory. Maintaining cylinder bore tolerances/block strength and heat dissipation are couple of reason in my memory serves me well this morning. Hopefully I'm not have one of my moments again lol.

Rusty · 03-13-2018, 09:29 AM

Need phunk to chime in. He would have the answers most likely.

jchammond · 03-13-2018, 09:10 PM

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Rid3_FaM0uS · 03-13-2018, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spooler

What compression ratio was your engine?

I have built both a 9:1, and an 11:1 comp ratio engine for my car now. Spent 3 years running down the 3.7L open deck block record at 850whp on my 9:1 engine. I tried literally everything. Different head gaskets, thicknesses, gasket coatings, clamping loads, had the heads O-ringed(final engine was a culmination of the three.). 8 head gasket sets, 2 blocks, and 8 connecting rods later I called it quits July of ‘17; when I lost another head gasket set after the dyno in may. Finally broke down, and invested in a closed deck block. Wasn’t until I took a stone to my old deck surface that I realized the there indeed are very noticeable high and low spots that form from cylinder expansions that are happening under high boost pressures. At the end of the day I’m telling you, one memeber to another, I don’t care who says what or what they think they know; your car WILL blow head gaskets over 800whp if you choose not to support the cylinder from shifting in some shape or form. 1Life the dynosty built haltech car did it at 820whp which is why he had his engine rebuilt, and purposefully turned back to 780-790.

FYI Charles is not looking to push Justin’s built car without some sort of cylinder reinforcement(whether that be dowels, inserts, or a block fill time will tell); they are merely using Justin’s car as a test bed to run the GTR head bolts which are currently being used on R35s well into the 12-1300whp realm. Not too bad considering the set of 16 can be bought for less that $100.

Rusty · 03-13-2018, 10:41 PM

That's some nasty gas cutting there. Wonder where the line was before needing cylinder reinforcement.

Spooler · 03-13-2018, 11:36 PM

Rid3_Famous, that is exactly what I needed. Data. Guess I will be opting for a closed deck block.

Rusty · 03-14-2018, 12:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spooler

Rid3_Famous, that is exactly what I needed. Data. Guess I will be opting for a closed deck block.

It's insurance. Why take chances for your power level.

Spooler · 03-14-2018, 12:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rusty

It's insurance. Why take chances for your power level.

Rabbit hole.

Rusty · 03-14-2018, 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spooler

Rabbit hole.

.

Elmo370z · 03-14-2018, 02:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rid3_FaM0uS

I have built both a 9:1, and an 11:1 comp ratio engine for my car now. Spent 3 years running down the 3.7L open deck block record at 850whp on my 9:1 engine. I tried literally everything. Different head gaskets, thicknesses, gasket coatings, clamping loads, had the heads O-ringed(final engine was a culmination of the three.). 8 head gasket sets, 2 blocks, and 8 connecting rods later I called it quits July of ‘17; when I lost another head gasket set after the dyno in may. Finally broke down, and invested in a closed deck block. Wasn’t until I took a stone to my old deck surface that I realized the there indeed are very noticeable high and low spots that form from cylinder expansions that are happening under high boost pressures. At the end of the day I’m telling you, one memeber to another, I don’t care who says what or what they think they know; your car WILL blow head gaskets over 800whp if you choose not to support the cylinder from shifting in some shape or form. 1Life the dynosty built haltech car did it at 820whp which is why he had his engine rebuilt, and purposefully turned back to 780-790.

FYI Charles is not looking to push Justin’s built car without some sort of cylinder reinforcement(whether that be dowels, inserts, or a block fill time will tell); they are merely using Justin’s car as a test bed to run the GTR head bolts which are currently being used on R35s well into the 12-1300whp realm. Not too bad considering the set of 16 can be bought for less that $100.

I think we are all interested in phunks experiment.

phunk · 03-14-2018, 04:02 AM

We have theories and ideas. None of it is worth more than anyone else's until it is accomplishing something.

I am not opposed to the closed deck conversion. I might prefer to try it with the support structure resting a bit below the deck rather than right at it.

I believe that there is a problem deeper in the block, literally. Cutaways of a VQ demonstrate IMHO some concerning lack of girth and doubt about its ability to hold its shape under extreme torsional loads. There is no limit to what can be done to address it, but the real question is, how little can we get away with?

03-12-2018, 10:49 PM	#61 (permalink)
Spooler A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Ga Posts: 13,951 Drives: 2013 Nismo 370z Rep Power: 2684392	Common Piston Failures. BGTV8, Rusty, Hotrodz and 1 others like this.

03-13-2018, 08:10 AM	#63 (permalink)
jchammond A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: South Carolina Age: 58 Posts: 15,204 Drives: 13’ 370Z TS 7A/T Rep Power: 2684395	Yeah, good videos. A question that I have (and probably tight lip info per engine builder) is ring gap setting. As the oem VQ37VHR has a ring gap of .0091” on 1st & 2nd ring. As the VQ isn’t normally boosted & looking over boosted recommendations of similar engines, such as a VR38DETT, ring gap setting on e85 is (bore x .005) 1st & second rings- up to 15lb boost & (bore x .006) 15-30lb. That’s (.018-.022) on 1st & 2nd rings. Make you wonder how boosting stock bottom ends & making big power over long periods of time is capable...engine must be very forgiving. Hotrodz, Elmo370z and Spooler like this. __________________ MazWorx built long block \| FI-TT-100 Stage 2.75 \| IPT built 7A/T http://www.the370z.com/members-370z-...s-musings.html

03-13-2018, 08:38 AM	#64 (permalink)
Spooler A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Ga Posts: 13,951 Drives: 2013 Nismo 370z Rep Power: 2684392	I am looking for info on a closed deck block. The benefits and pitfalls. Maybe I can find something good here also. Hotrodz likes this.

03-13-2018, 09:29 AM	#66 (permalink)
Rusty Ronin Samurai - Assassin Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Fayettenam,Pennsyltucky Age: 69 Posts: 35,341 Drives: 2011 Nismo GM 6M Rep Power: 2684438	Need phunk to chime in. He would have the answers most likely. Hotrodz, Spooler and jchammond like this. __________________ 浪人 - 殺し屋 "The Difficult Anytime, The Impossible By Appointment Only" http://www.the370z.com/members-370z-...o-journal.html

03-13-2018, 09:10 PM	#67 (permalink)
jchammond A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: South Carolina Age: 58 Posts: 15,204 Drives: 13’ 370Z TS 7A/T Rep Power: 2684395	Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Elmo370z, Spooler and redondoaveb like this. __________________ MazWorx built long block \| FI-TT-100 Stage 2.75 \| IPT built 7A/T http://www.the370z.com/members-370z-...s-musings.html

03-13-2018, 10:41 PM	#69 (permalink)
Rusty Ronin Samurai - Assassin Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Fayettenam,Pennsyltucky Age: 69 Posts: 35,341 Drives: 2011 Nismo GM 6M Rep Power: 2684438	That's some nasty gas cutting there. Wonder where the line was before needing cylinder reinforcement. __________________ 浪人 - 殺し屋 "The Difficult Anytime, The Impossible By Appointment Only" http://www.the370z.com/members-370z-...o-journal.html

03-13-2018, 11:36 PM	#70 (permalink)
Spooler A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Ga Posts: 13,951 Drives: 2013 Nismo 370z Rep Power: 2684392	Rid3_Famous, that is exactly what I needed. Data. Guess I will be opting for a closed deck block. Rid3_FaM0uS, Hotrodz and jchammond like this.

03-14-2018, 04:02 AM	#75 (permalink)
phunk A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Chicago Posts: 3,669 Drives: 370 Rep Power: 974724	We have theories and ideas. None of it is worth more than anyone else's until it is accomplishing something. I am not opposed to the closed deck conversion. I might prefer to try it with the support structure resting a bit below the deck rather than right at it. I believe that there is a problem deeper in the block, literally. Cutaways of a VQ demonstrate IMHO some concerning lack of girth and doubt about its ability to hold its shape under extreme torsional loads. There is no limit to what can be done to address it, but the real question is, how little can we get away with? Rusty, Rid3_FaM0uS, blueranger and 2 others like this. __________________ Charles @ CJ Motorsports : Website \| Facebook \| Instagram \| YouTube Home of the 9 second, stock longblock, stock drivetrain 6MT 370z. 9.91 @ 142mph

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