Nissan 370Z Forum  

Preparation for the STILLEN supercharger

Guys boost is boost no matter if its from a supercharger or a turbo.... If another kit is putting down 450-500 @ 6-9psi thats what the stillen will do... the

Go Back   Nissan 370Z Forum > Nissan 370Z Tech Area > Engine & Drivetrain > Forced Induction


Like Tree1Likes

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-22-2010, 10:27 AM   #196 (permalink)
Base Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Fort Worth
Posts: 153
Drives: 05 Chrome Silver
Rep Power: 16
Zguy is on a distinguished road
Default

Guys boost is boost no matter if its from a supercharger or a turbo.... If another kit is putting down 450-500 @ 6-9psi thats what the stillen will do... the only differences that I know of is when the boost comes on... Turbo= for the most part all at once somewhere in the rpm band... Supercharger linear gains boost with rpm

There are other factors in there that effect efficiency but for the most part I think it will put the same HP down as the TT's that are out now as long as the psi is the same, peak HP should be the same. Torque will be different though....
Zguy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2010, 11:15 AM   #197 (permalink)
A True Z Fanatic
 
LiquidZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Columbus, OH
Posts: 1,940
Drives: Mag. Black 2009 370Z
Rep Power: 704
LiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zguy View Post
Guys boost is boost no matter if its from a supercharger or a turbo.... If another kit is putting down 450-500 @ 6-9psi thats what the stillen will do... the only differences that I know of is when the boost comes on... Turbo= for the most part all at once somewhere in the rpm band... Supercharger linear gains boost with rpm

There are other factors in there that effect efficiency but for the most part I think it will put the same HP down as the TT's that are out now as long as the psi is the same, peak HP should be the same. Torque will be different though....
This is not entirely true. Superchargers require work input from the engine
to spin. This extra work required by the supercharger does consume horsepower. As an example, a turbo at 6 psi might produce 450 whp whereas a supercharger at 6 psi might produce 430 whp.

The only way a supercharger would produce the same power at the same level of boost is to run it off of a completely isolated and powered motor, thus bypassing the horsepower robbing work required by a supercharger to work.
__________________
LiquidZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2010, 12:00 PM   #198 (permalink)
Base Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Montgomery, TX
Posts: 119
Drives: 2010 370Z 7at sp pg
Rep Power: 16
KEVTEX is on a distinguished road
Default

It also takes some horsepower to spin the turbo. There is no free lunch.
KEVTEX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2010, 12:05 PM   #199 (permalink)
A True Z Fanatic
 
LiquidZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Columbus, OH
Posts: 1,940
Drives: Mag. Black 2009 370Z
Rep Power: 704
LiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by KEVTEX View Post
It also takes some horsepower to spin the turbo. There is no free lunch.
I fail to see this. The turbo requires no work from the engine to spin.

I'm just going to stop here before a supercharger vs turbo debate explodes.
__________________
LiquidZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2010, 12:06 PM   #200 (permalink)
A True Z Fanatic
 
G37Sam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Dubai, UAE
Posts: 1,507
Drives: RB'd G37
Rep Power: 20
G37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud of
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by KEVTEX View Post
It also takes some horsepower to spin the turbo. There is no free lunch.
Exactly, the back pressure put by the turbine on the engine "robs" horsepower too you know..
__________________
'14 Viper GTS
'08 RB'd G37S - Sold
G37Sam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2010, 12:14 PM   #201 (permalink)
A True Z Fanatic
 
G37Sam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Dubai, UAE
Posts: 1,507
Drives: RB'd G37
Rep Power: 20
G37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud of
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LiquidZ View Post
I fail to see this. The turbo requires no work from the engine to spin.
So if you turn the engine off does the turbo still spin?
__________________
'14 Viper GTS
'08 RB'd G37S - Sold
G37Sam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2010, 12:33 PM   #202 (permalink)
A True Z Fanatic
 
LiquidZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Columbus, OH
Posts: 1,940
Drives: Mag. Black 2009 370Z
Rep Power: 704
LiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by G37Sam View Post
So if you turn the engine off does the turbo still spin?
For a short period of time, yes. The turbo impeller/turbine
wheel maintain some rotational velocity once the exhaust gases stop flowing. Obviously, once internal friction forces take over, the rotational velocity of the impeller/turbine decreases to zero.

Yes, turbos do add backpressure which can be seen to limit power output, but my point was the turbo requires no mechanical work from the actual engine to spin and produce power. The turbo simply works off of waste exhaust gas, and not the engine itself.
__________________
LiquidZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2010, 12:55 PM   #203 (permalink)
Base Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 153
Drives: 370Z Base+Sport 6M
Rep Power: 16
phantom21 will become famous soon enough
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LiquidZ View Post
I fail to see this. The turbo requires no work from the engine to spin.

I'm just going to stop here before a supercharger vs turbo debate explodes.
SSSHHHHh!!! lets not talk about exploding.
__________________
2009 PG 6spd Sport || 30% side tint, 15% rear || All Redline fluids || Berk HFC's intalled~PITA Bolt || Stillen G3's || Berk CBE || BC Racing Coilovers with 10K/12K Swift springs & RA valving|| SPL rear camber arms || 20mm/15mm spacers
phantom21 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2010, 03:56 PM   #204 (permalink)
A True Z Fanatic
 
Zsteve's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: TX
Posts: 3,298
Drives: the 2 balled club
Rep Power: 22
Zsteve is a splendid one to beholdZsteve is a splendid one to beholdZsteve is a splendid one to beholdZsteve is a splendid one to beholdZsteve is a splendid one to beholdZsteve is a splendid one to beholdZsteve is a splendid one to behold
Default

dont the engines need back pressure? Thats why I thought turbos could go bigger diameter exhausts cuz the turbo itself provides the needed back pressure but NA cars have it provided by the exhaust itself.
__________________
2010 LS3 C6 Silver coupe corvette
Zsteve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2010, 04:32 PM   #205 (permalink)
Base Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Montgomery, TX
Posts: 119
Drives: 2010 370Z 7at sp pg
Rep Power: 16
KEVTEX is on a distinguished road
Default

The energy required to spin a compressor(turbo or supercharger) only comes from one place. That is from the engine itself. Superchargers take the power directly from the crankshaft.
Turbo's get their power indirectly from the extra work the pistons have to do, to force the exhaust past the turbo impeller.
KEVTEX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2010, 05:30 PM   #206 (permalink)
Enthusiast Member
 
2fast4thelaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Denver Co
Age: 50
Posts: 403
Drives: 09 370Z Sport/MT6
Rep Power: 16
2fast4thelaw will become famous soon enough
Default

Its only work for the engine at lower rpm, once the turbo spools up beyond inertial forces then any power loss essentially dissapears.

Unfortunatly in the case of a supercharger the faster it spins, the more power it takes to drive the supercharger.
__________________
To the optimist, the glass is half full. To the pessimist, the glass is half empty. To the engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.
2fast4thelaw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2010, 05:53 PM   #207 (permalink)
Base Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Montgomery, TX
Posts: 119
Drives: 2010 370Z 7at sp pg
Rep Power: 16
KEVTEX is on a distinguished road
Default

Turbo's don't spin themselves,even after spool up.
KEVTEX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2010, 05:55 PM   #208 (permalink)
A True Z Fanatic
 
LiquidZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Columbus, OH
Posts: 1,940
Drives: Mag. Black 2009 370Z
Rep Power: 704
LiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond reputeLiquidZ has a reputation beyond repute
Default

What did I start
__________________
LiquidZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2010, 06:26 PM   #209 (permalink)
Enthusiast Member
 
StillenZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Indiana
Posts: 283
Drives: 09 Nissan 370Z Red M
Rep Power: 16
StillenZ is on a distinguished road
Default

LOL...LiquidZ had a logical explanation imo but my opinion isn't worth a whole lot lol...

Can't wait to see pics and #'s Kyle!!! I threw up a little earlier with the 90-120 days comment lol Looking forward to any new updates!
__________________
Stillen Dual Exhaust / Stillen Gen 3 Intake / Stillen Headers / Eibach Pro-Kit / Euro Fog Lamp / 1000W JL Audio Amp / 2 - 12' JBL P1222's / Pioneer In-dash Nav
StillenZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2010, 07:09 PM   #210 (permalink)
A True Z Fanatic
 
G37Sam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Dubai, UAE
Posts: 1,507
Drives: RB'd G37
Rep Power: 20
G37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud ofG37Sam has much to be proud of
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LiquidZ View Post
For a short period of time, yes. The turbo impeller/turbine
wheel maintain some rotational velocity once the exhaust gases stop flowing. Obviously, once internal friction forces take over, the rotational velocity of the impeller/turbine decreases to zero.

Yes, turbos do add backpressure which can be seen to limit power output, but my point was the turbo requires no mechanical work from the actual engine to spin and produce power. The turbo simply works off of waste exhaust gas, and not the engine itself.
LOOOL I like what you did there, very smart.

You know I wasn't referring to the interial energy stored in the turbo due it being a rotating mass.

I was just saying, to get the turbine spinning, the pistons have to put extra effort to push the exhaust gasses through it. That extra effort would be "robbed" from the engine's total bhp. Where else would the energy come from?
__________________
'14 Viper GTS
'08 RB'd G37S - Sold
G37Sam is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Stillen Supercharger estimates??? NewYorkJon34 Forced Induction 454 01-23-2010 12:05 AM
Southern "Winter" preparation? Matt South East Region 1 11-27-2009 06:23 PM
Titan supercharger madmocasin Forced Induction 41 11-09-2009 02:23 AM
Will Stillen Supercharger & G3 intakes Connect? NewYorkJon34 Forced Induction 23 10-31-2009 01:09 AM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:07 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2