Black smoke out back, engine splutter

YzGyz · 11-03-2015, 05:59 PM

I think it will buff out ok...

6qt of Mobile 1 with about 1600 miles on it and 2 1/4mi drag days.

So UPSET right now. GRR!!!!!! I went to 4 Big Box auto stores and nothing. I called Grainger and went to fry's still nothing!! WTF!!! Stupid 5 pin 20a/30a relay!!

The only relay I found so far in my quick search is for a lot of 10 of them.. WTF.. Anyone know where I can order or get one of these in Houston?? Gezz!!

YzGyz

Edit: I found some online. took some research to find but Amazon Primed that hoe!!

jwick · 11-03-2015, 07:43 PM

That relay should not look like that. Have you checked all the other wiring?

Boosted Performance · 11-03-2015, 08:31 PM

That relay look brutal. I don't understand how that would be possible..it's almost as if it was under water for a long time.

YzGyz · 11-03-2015, 08:42 PM

Yeah, it does look bad. The relay itself was turned upside down then I was trouble shooting and found the problem. The cap had a little bit of moisture in it and probably filled up at one time. I'm thinking that the engine bay warming and cooling in could of formed condensation in it and just pooled over time. The high humidity from all these stormed and rain don't help it either. The other thing is that it could have been my fault from when I washed my engine bay with a hose and De-greaser. However, I doubt it as the wires are tucked in the fuse area which is separated from the engine area. It could be my fault.

Anyhoo, waiting for the relay before I trouble shoot some more and try to find the disappearing coolant problem.

YzGyz

2011 Nismo#91 · 11-04-2015, 09:02 AM

1987 1992 Jeep Rear Wiper Fog Lamp Headlight Relay AR502 with Bracket | eBay

CEC Industries, LTD. Your Global Partner In Lighting Solutions

Searching for:
"2 Speed Changeover Relay with Bracket" and/or "AR502"
But as long as the voltage is 12 and the Amp is at least 30 you should be fine with any similar part.

This should work too.
HELLA H41388461

SouthArk370Z · 11-04-2015, 11:06 AM

Since the relay didn't seem to hold up in your application, I wouldn't use it as a replacement unless you can somehow water-proof it.

As per 2011 Nismo#91, the coil needs to be 12 VDC and the contacts rated for 30 A (when two figures are given, the first is usually the "make" rating and the second is the "break" rating - when in doubt, go with the higher figure).
If there is no connection to 87a, you can use a NO SPST (Normally Open, Single-Pole Single-Throw).

YzGyz · 11-04-2015, 12:50 PM

Thanks guys, I'm a electrical noob when it comes to anything other than audio systems. I can plug and hook that up with little problems. "If there is no connection to 87a, you can use a NO SPST (Normally Open, Single-Pole Single-Throw)" is beyond me. I went and ordered what the old one said on it. A 20a/30a 5 pin (I counted the pins in the back) and bought one with the same 20a/30a and similar diagram on it. I found plenty of 30a relays and 40a relays. I just didn't find and 20a/30a relays. Hopefully it comes fast so I can trouble shoot and get my car back on the road.

Next on the list is to check to make sure all coolant clamps are secure correctly, then mark the overflow/res with a piece of tape and coolant level, start the car and let her run for a while and heat/build pressure, look around for signs of leak/seepage (w/o burning myself), and fix what is needed or button her up and keep an eye on the coolant and temp.

YzGyz

SouthArk370Z · 11-04-2015, 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YzGyz

... I found plenty of 30a relays and 40a relays. I just didn't find and 20a/30a relays. ...

As long as it is rated 30 A or greater, you will be OK. Larger ampacity relays usually pull more power for the coil but shouldn't be a big deal (unless you move up to really big relay).

2011 Nismo#91 · 11-04-2015, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SouthArk370Z

Since the relay didn't seem to hold up in your application, I wouldn't use it as a replacement unless you can somehow water-proof it.

As per 2011 Nismo#91, the coil needs to be 12 VDC and the contacts rated for 30 A (when two figures are given, the first is usually the "make" rating and the second is the "break" rating - when in doubt, go with the higher figure).
If there is no connection to 87a, you can use a NO SPST (Normally Open, Single-Pole Single-Throw).

It's weird how I read the description one pin out is 20A and the other was 30A. But anyway as a precaution you should wrap up any openings with good electrical tape.

RadioFlyer · 11-05-2015, 08:22 PM

If you have it upside down, drill a hole in the plastic cover to let water drain out of it if any water finds it's way in.

Also, the coughing and sputtering could be because of a bad MAF sensor. You could try to unplug them and it would force the car to run in open loop, where it doesn't use the MAF sensors. If your idle smooths out with them unplugged, then one of them is bad. I doubt it if they'd both go bad at the same time.

phunk · 11-06-2015, 04:14 AM

It's possible your cooling system just had some air still in it, and was able to empty the overflow on cool down after expelling the air?

I've only seen a blown HG on a VQ once and it did not mix water with oil. What it would do was allow combustion pressure into the cooling system during full throttle, which would cause the coolant reservoir to overflow (and mist coolant on the windshield through the vented hood), and then after cool down it would draw the reservoir empty.

YzGyz · 11-06-2015, 10:10 AM

I'm fairly sure it's not an air pocket as I installed the CSF like 4k miles or so before I boosted her or something like that. I can't imagine the car taking that many miles to work out an air pocket. Then again, it could happen.

I did not notice any mist of air or anything other than the initial start up with the low fluid. After topping it off, it was all clear. I was hawking the water temp dots and the oil temp the whole drive home. The water dots were 1 or 2 dots less than 1/2 way and the oil temp stayed around 180 deg on the rainy cool TX morning.

I hope it's not a pin hole leak as those can be hard to find. I won't know till I start her up and and let the engine get hot, build pressure and I carefully snoop around. This wont happen until I get that darn 20/30 amp relay though. Come on mail man!!

YzGyz

SouthArk370Z · 11-06-2015, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YzGyz

... This wont happen until I get that darn 20/30 amp relay though. Come on mail man!!

For testing purposes, just about any relay with a 12 VDC coil and at least one NO SPST* contact rated for 30 A will work.

*DPDT or a TPDT will work, you just will have some terminals that are not connected. See http://www.vertex-qis.co.uk/Manuals/..._explained.pdf for more info.

YzGyz · 11-09-2015, 07:47 PM

Update, Relay replaced. The pump turn off with the car like it's suppose to again. I didn't notice and excess smoke out the back. I suspect it was from working the pedal when the battery was low, trying to turn her over. I also looked around and found a leak in the coolant system. The bottom OEM clamp on the radiator has weakened and leaks when the system come to temp. I had to run out and buy a worm screw type and clamp her down. It stopped the leak. I will have to do another visual inspection tomorrow in the day light to make sure everything else is ok.

I also did not know how hot the oil lines got. Sure, I know that they are as hot at the engine running temp but man. I see some smoke coming off them. I moved the oil like myself and the smoke defiantly comes from the oil lines.

YzGyz

jwick · 11-09-2015, 10:04 PM

Don't leave a worm drive clamp on that silicon hose it'll tear it up. Get a t-bolt clamp

11-03-2015, 05:59 PM	#16 (permalink)
YzGyz A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Houston Posts: 1,449 Drives: 2010 Nismo Rep Power: 63	I think it will buff out ok... 6qt of Mobile 1 with about 1600 miles on it and 2 1/4mi drag days. So UPSET right now. GRR!!!!!! I went to 4 Big Box auto stores and nothing. I called Grainger and went to fry's still nothing!! WTF!!! Stupid 5 pin 20a/30a relay!! The only relay I found so far in my quick search is for a lot of 10 of them.. WTF.. Anyone know where I can order or get one of these in Houston?? Gezz!! YzGyz Edit: I found some online. took some research to find but Amazon Primed that hoe!! hjo1078 likes this. __________________ http://www.the370z.com/members-370z-...gyzs-turn.html YzGyz Last edited by YzGyz; 11-03-2015 at 07:06 PM.

11-03-2015, 07:43 PM	#17 (permalink)
jwick A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Houston Posts: 14,532 Drives: '10 G37 6MT Rep Power: 2465056	That relay should not look like that. Have you checked all the other wiring? __________________ '10 G37T 6MT Graphite/Graphite - BP - G37T Build

11-03-2015, 08:31 PM	#18 (permalink)
Boosted Performance The370Z.com Sponsor Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Edmonton, AB Posts: 1,629 Drives: Z's Rep Power: 3382	That relay look brutal. I don't understand how that would be possible..it's almost as if it was under water for a long time. __________________ 750WHP starting @ $7,500 to the door FOR DETAILS VISIT: http://www.the370z.com/members/boosted-performance.html FB: https://www.facebook.com/Boosted-Per...6303179791462/ IG @boostedperformanceyeg

11-03-2015, 08:42 PM	#19 (permalink)
YzGyz A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Houston Posts: 1,449 Drives: 2010 Nismo Rep Power: 63	Yeah, it does look bad. The relay itself was turned upside down then I was trouble shooting and found the problem. The cap had a little bit of moisture in it and probably filled up at one time. I'm thinking that the engine bay warming and cooling in could of formed condensation in it and just pooled over time. The high humidity from all these stormed and rain don't help it either. The other thing is that it could have been my fault from when I washed my engine bay with a hose and De-greaser. However, I doubt it as the wires are tucked in the fuse area which is separated from the engine area. It could be my fault. Anyhoo, waiting for the relay before I trouble shoot some more and try to find the disappearing coolant problem. YzGyz __________________ http://www.the370z.com/members-370z-...gyzs-turn.html YzGyz

11-04-2015, 09:02 AM	#20 (permalink)
2011 Nismo#91 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: NJ Posts: 2,400 Drives: slowly Rep Power: 40569	1987 1992 Jeep Rear Wiper Fog Lamp Headlight Relay AR502 with Bracket \| eBay CEC Industries, LTD. Your Global Partner In Lighting Solutions Searching for: "2 Speed Changeover Relay with Bracket" and/or "AR502" But as long as the voltage is 12 and the Amp is at least 30 you should be fine with any similar part. This should work too. HELLA H41388461 SouthArk370Z likes this. Last edited by 2011 Nismo#91; 11-04-2015 at 09:06 AM.

11-04-2015, 11:06 AM	#21 (permalink)
SouthArk370Z Premium Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: South Arkansas Posts: 8,435 Drives: 2014 Challenger Rep Power: 324198	Since the relay didn't seem to hold up in your application, I wouldn't use it as a replacement unless you can somehow water-proof it. As per 2011 Nismo#91, the coil needs to be 12 VDC and the contacts rated for 30 A (when two figures are given, the first is usually the "make" rating and the second is the "break" rating - when in doubt, go with the higher figure). If there is no connection to 87a, you can use a NO SPST (Normally Open, Single-Pole Single-Throw). __________________ Steering Lock Links - Search The370Z Bookmarklet - FSM @ NICOclub Mankind has progressed past the need for war but we haven't evolved that far. - NachoMahma

11-04-2015, 12:50 PM	#22 (permalink)
YzGyz A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Houston Posts: 1,449 Drives: 2010 Nismo Rep Power: 63	Thanks guys, I'm a electrical noob when it comes to anything other than audio systems. I can plug and hook that up with little problems. "If there is no connection to 87a, you can use a NO SPST (Normally Open, Single-Pole Single-Throw)" is beyond me. I went and ordered what the old one said on it. A 20a/30a 5 pin (I counted the pins in the back) and bought one with the same 20a/30a and similar diagram on it. I found plenty of 30a relays and 40a relays. I just didn't find and 20a/30a relays. Hopefully it comes fast so I can trouble shoot and get my car back on the road. Next on the list is to check to make sure all coolant clamps are secure correctly, then mark the overflow/res with a piece of tape and coolant level, start the car and let her run for a while and heat/build pressure, look around for signs of leak/seepage (w/o burning myself), and fix what is needed or button her up and keep an eye on the coolant and temp. YzGyz __________________ http://www.the370z.com/members-370z-...gyzs-turn.html YzGyz

11-05-2015, 08:22 PM	#25 (permalink)
RadioFlyer Base Member Join Date: Aug 2014 Location: Los Angeles, CA. Posts: 193 Drives: 08 G37S S/C Rep Power: 40	If you have it upside down, drill a hole in the plastic cover to let water drain out of it if any water finds it's way in. Also, the coughing and sputtering could be because of a bad MAF sensor. You could try to unplug them and it would force the car to run in open loop, where it doesn't use the MAF sensors. If your idle smooths out with them unplugged, then one of them is bad. I doubt it if they'd both go bad at the same time.

11-06-2015, 04:14 AM	#26 (permalink)
phunk A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Chicago Posts: 3,668 Drives: 370 Rep Power: 974723	It's possible your cooling system just had some air still in it, and was able to empty the overflow on cool down after expelling the air? I've only seen a blown HG on a VQ once and it did not mix water with oil. What it would do was allow combustion pressure into the cooling system during full throttle, which would cause the coolant reservoir to overflow (and mist coolant on the windshield through the vented hood), and then after cool down it would draw the reservoir empty. __________________ Charles @ CJ Motorsports : Website \| Facebook \| Instagram \| YouTube Home of the 9 second, stock longblock, stock drivetrain 6MT 370z. 9.91 @ 142mph

11-06-2015, 10:10 AM	#27 (permalink)
YzGyz A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Houston Posts: 1,449 Drives: 2010 Nismo Rep Power: 63	I'm fairly sure it's not an air pocket as I installed the CSF like 4k miles or so before I boosted her or something like that. I can't imagine the car taking that many miles to work out an air pocket. Then again, it could happen. I did not notice any mist of air or anything other than the initial start up with the low fluid. After topping it off, it was all clear. I was hawking the water temp dots and the oil temp the whole drive home. The water dots were 1 or 2 dots less than 1/2 way and the oil temp stayed around 180 deg on the rainy cool TX morning. I hope it's not a pin hole leak as those can be hard to find. I won't know till I start her up and and let the engine get hot, build pressure and I carefully snoop around. This wont happen until I get that darn 20/30 amp relay though. Come on mail man!! YzGyz __________________ http://www.the370z.com/members-370z-...gyzs-turn.html YzGyz

11-09-2015, 07:47 PM	#29 (permalink)
YzGyz A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Houston Posts: 1,449 Drives: 2010 Nismo Rep Power: 63	Update, Relay replaced. The pump turn off with the car like it's suppose to again. I didn't notice and excess smoke out the back. I suspect it was from working the pedal when the battery was low, trying to turn her over. I also looked around and found a leak in the coolant system. The bottom OEM clamp on the radiator has weakened and leaks when the system come to temp. I had to run out and buy a worm screw type and clamp her down. It stopped the leak. I will have to do another visual inspection tomorrow in the day light to make sure everything else is ok. I also did not know how hot the oil lines got. Sure, I know that they are as hot at the engine running temp but man. I see some smoke coming off them. I moved the oil like myself and the smoke defiantly comes from the oil lines. YzGyz SouthArk370Z likes this. __________________ http://www.the370z.com/members-370z-...gyzs-turn.html YzGyz Last edited by YzGyz; 11-09-2015 at 07:51 PM.

11-09-2015, 10:04 PM	#30 (permalink)
jwick A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Houston Posts: 14,532 Drives: '10 G37 6MT Rep Power: 2465056	Black smoke out back, engine splutter Don't leave a worm drive clamp on that silicon hose it'll tear it up. Get a t-bolt clamp YzGyz likes this. __________________ '10 G37T 6MT Graphite/Graphite - BP - G37T Build

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