Stillen U.D. pulleys help.

Elmo370z · 12-04-2014, 08:54 PM

I ordered stillen underdrive crank pulley and belt, after talking to my shop about the install they informed me that it would replace the damper which I didn't know was fluid filled to aid in engine vibration. Is the vibration that serve with the U.D.? Would NST pulley set work with the stillen U.D.? Or should I just try to sell them?

DEpointfive0 · 12-04-2014, 09:14 PM

What fuckíng horseshit shop did you go to? Go somewhere else that doesn't shove their head up their own ásses for lunch...

Fluid filled, LOOOOOOL!!! Dampener, LOOOOOOOOL!!! It's a solid piece of cast iron, no fluid or dampener anywhere

Chuck33079 · 12-04-2014, 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DEpointfive0

What fuckíng horseshit shop did you go to? Go somewhere else that doesn't shove their head up their own ásses for lunch...

Fluid filled, LOOOOOOL!!! Dampener, LOOOOOOOOL!!! It's a solid piece of cast iron, no fluid or dampener anywhere

Pretty much took the words out of my mouth.

Elmo370z · 12-04-2014, 09:38 PM

SO they are fudging me around. They told me that I would have serve vibrations using the underdrive pulley, and since it is 20% underdrive my other pulley's couldn't keep up.

Masterbeatty · 12-04-2014, 10:28 PM

How you say......ra tards!

BGTV8 · 12-04-2014, 10:29 PM

You are going to get more vibration because you are removing the vibration damper .... you may not feel them because they are harmonics at higher rpm.

Whether it is a damper that is fluid filled or just a ring of cast iron, it is no longer present, so the damper effect is actually removed.

Whether this is going to affect your engine is the real issue. If you give the car a spanking every now and then, probably not, but drag it or track it with sustained hi-rpms, it might.

Many years ago, with a race engine based on a Traco-Olds 215, that was all internally balanced and with the crank damper deleted, we kept losing cranks and eventually solved the problem by using an ATL race damper, so I can confirm that revving the engine hard enough for long enough with cause failure.

DD road duties, it "should" last for as long as you own it ...

DEpointfive0 · 12-04-2014, 11:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BGTV8

You are going to get more vibration because you are removing the vibration damper .... you may not feel them because they are harmonics at higher rpm.

Whether it is a damper that is fluid filled or just a ring of cast iron, it is no longer present, so the damper effect is actually removed.

Whether this is going to affect your engine is the real issue. If you give the car a spanking every now and then, probably not, but drag it or track it with sustained hi-rpms, it might.

Many years ago, with a race engine based on a Traco-Olds 215, that was all internally balanced and with the crank damper deleted, we kept losing cranks and eventually solved the problem by using an ATL race damper, so I can confirm that revving the engine hard enough for long enough with cause failure.

DD road duties, it "should" last for as long as you own it ...

On THIS car, where is the dampener on the pulley?

BGTV8 · 12-05-2014, 12:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DEpointfive0

On THIS car, where is the dampener on the pulley?

Refer page 1679 of workshop manual - is integral/internal to the pulley ... refer snips attached. Also here:
http://workshop-manuals.com/nissan/3...iew/page_1679/

If you reckon there is no damper, knock yourself out ... my workshop manual reckons it is internal to the OEM pulley and with 20K in parts to go into my race engine, I will be fitting a Ross damper.

Like I said to the OP, maybe not necessary on a DD but my bus lives at 6500-7500rpm on regular track days.

Tread your own path ....

DEpointfive0 · 12-05-2014, 01:02 AM

STILLEN lightweight crank pulley

Zoren 370 · 12-05-2014, 01:16 AM

I have a stillen pulley no vibration no dampers no fluid all I know it was all fun fun...

Elmo370z · 12-05-2014, 01:17 AM

thank you all

DEpointfive0 · 12-05-2014, 01:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BGTV8

Refer page 1679 of workshop manual - is integral/internal to the pulley ... refer snips attached. Also here:
Nissan and Datsun Workshop Manuals > 370Z V6-3.7L (VQ37VHR) (2010) > Engine, Cooling and Exhaust > Engine > Timing Components > Timing Chain > Component Information > Service and Repair > Exploded View > Page 1679

If you reckon there is no damper, knock yourself out ... my workshop manual reckons it is internal to the OEM pulley and with 20K in parts to go into my race engine, I will be fitting a Ross damper.

Like I said to the OP, maybe not necessary on a DD but my bus lives at 6500-7500rpm on regular track days.

Tread your own path ....

May I pose the question of... (And I don't mean to be an ásshole)

Does an aftermarket flywheel damage the car? After all the flywheel is on the other end of the crank, and weighs MUCH more than the crank pulley, and is much bigger, so even the slightest vibration has gotta make a bigger difference, no?

BGTV8 · 12-05-2014, 02:47 AM

It is not vibration per se, it is the harmonics .. I'll find a reference for you and post it here later.

Reference 1: Wikpedia on harmonics: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Engine_balance
Reference 2: Coming .....

In my post I used the word "vibration" but to be strictly accurate, I should have used the word "harmonic vibration".

It is harmonic vibration that destroys OEM oil pump gears in the VQ engine above 7500rpm - I cannot find the actual engine speed as my notes are in the orifice at work - but it is around 7600-7700.

The reason I have reservations about after-market pulley kits is that no-one knows what engine speed the critical harmonics are exhibited ... and these harmonic vibrations are engine killers ...

If you want to know more, take the time to speak to Jackson Stewart at Unitech Racing as I have done several times, or Clark Steppler at JWT and I am sure they can fill you in on the details.

A flywheel is an inertia storage device, not a damper.

The purpose of the damper on the nose of the crank is to either shift the rotational frequency (engine rpm) at which catastrophic harmonics become evident out of the engine operating range, or to damp them such that they are no longer destructive.

Mate, you can disagree with me, even tell me I am a d1ck-head full of sh1t, but 40 years of motorsport and the pain and disappointment of losing 3 cranks in one season taught me a hard lesson about harmonics, and that is knowledge that I respect.

Now, the OP was told by his shop the proceed with care, and all I am doing is echoing those words of advice.

I do not know what the implications for after-market pulleys actually are - they may be totally benign (and probably are) but if the OP wants to use his vehicle on the track or strip, I am simply saying buyer beware.

There is no need to continue this thread .. because we are each accountable to ourselves for our own actions - I am not dictating to the OP, merely providing fact-based information that may, or may not, be pertinent to his post.

He (and you) are always at liberty to ignore the statements and that is your right.

As I said, tread your own path ....

DEpointfive0 · 12-05-2014, 03:00 AM

^I like you
Since I have been informed that you Aussie's don't drink Foster's in Australia... If you ever make your way to the states, Foster's on me! Lol

1slow370 · 12-05-2014, 03:34 AM

7500rpm with the factory balancer.

12-04-2014, 08:54 PM	#1 (permalink)
Elmo370z A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: st. petersburg Posts: 5,709 Drives: 09 nissan 370z Sp M6 Rep Power: 295378	Stillen U.D. pulleys help. I ordered stillen underdrive crank pulley and belt, after talking to my shop about the install they informed me that it would replace the damper which I didn't know was fluid filled to aid in engine vibration. Is the vibration that serve with the U.D.? Would NST pulley set work with the stillen U.D.? Or should I just try to sell them?

12-04-2014, 09:14 PM	#2 (permalink)
DEpointfive0 Premium Member Bitches Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: SoCal Posts: 14,824 Drives: a lot Rep Power: 17151	What fuckíng horseshit shop did you go to? Go somewhere else that doesn't shove their head up their own ásses for lunch... Fluid filled, LOOOOOOL!!! Dampener, LOOOOOOOOL!!! It's a solid piece of cast iron, no fluid or dampener anywhere TerribleONE, JARblue and Zoren 370 like this. __________________ Do YOU want to know what/where I got my username from? ( Click to show/hide ) NSFW due to language:

12-04-2014, 10:28 PM	#5 (permalink)
Masterbeatty A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2012 Location: Whales Vagina Posts: 4,586 Drives: the speed limit... Rep Power: 122867	How you say......ra tards! __________________ 2011 MB 6MT Masterbeatty journal

12-05-2014, 01:02 AM	#9 (permalink)
DEpointfive0 Premium Member Bitches Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: SoCal Posts: 14,824 Drives: a lot Rep Power: 17151	STILLEN lightweight crank pulley Elmo370z likes this. __________________ Do YOU want to know what/where I got my username from? ( Click to show/hide ) NSFW due to language:

12-05-2014, 01:16 AM	#10 (permalink)
Zoren 370 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: FL Posts: 11,018 Drives: 11 Nissan 370 M6 Rep Power: 1913653	I have a stillen pulley no vibration no dampers no fluid all I know it was all fun fun... DEpointfive0 and Joker_J like this.

12-04-2014, 09:38 PM	#4 (permalink)
Elmo370z A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: st. petersburg Posts: 5,709 Drives: 09 nissan 370z Sp M6 Rep Power: 295378	SO they are fudging me around. They told me that I would have serve vibrations using the underdrive pulley, and since it is 20% underdrive my other pulley's couldn't keep up.

12-04-2014, 10:29 PM	#6 (permalink)
BGTV8 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: 03350 Australia Posts: 1,514 Drives: 09 Nissan 370Z M6 Rep Power: 39973	You are going to get more vibration because you are removing the vibration damper .... you may not feel them because they are harmonics at higher rpm. Whether it is a damper that is fluid filled or just a ring of cast iron, it is no longer present, so the damper effect is actually removed. Whether this is going to affect your engine is the real issue. If you give the car a spanking every now and then, probably not, but drag it or track it with sustained hi-rpms, it might. Many years ago, with a race engine based on a Traco-Olds 215, that was all internally balanced and with the crank damper deleted, we kept losing cranks and eventually solved the problem by using an ATL race damper, so I can confirm that revving the engine hard enough for long enough with cause failure. DD road duties, it "should" last for as long as you own it ...

12-05-2014, 01:17 AM	#11 (permalink)
Elmo370z A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: st. petersburg Posts: 5,709 Drives: 09 nissan 370z Sp M6 Rep Power: 295378	thank you all

12-05-2014, 02:47 AM	#13 (permalink)
BGTV8 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: 03350 Australia Posts: 1,514 Drives: 09 Nissan 370Z M6 Rep Power: 39973	It is not vibration per se, it is the harmonics .. I'll find a reference for you and post it here later. Reference 1: Wikpedia on harmonics: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Engine_balance Reference 2: Coming ..... In my post I used the word "vibration" but to be strictly accurate, I should have used the word "harmonic vibration". It is harmonic vibration that destroys OEM oil pump gears in the VQ engine above 7500rpm - I cannot find the actual engine speed as my notes are in the orifice at work - but it is around 7600-7700. The reason I have reservations about after-market pulley kits is that no-one knows what engine speed the critical harmonics are exhibited ... and these harmonic vibrations are engine killers ... If you want to know more, take the time to speak to Jackson Stewart at Unitech Racing as I have done several times, or Clark Steppler at JWT and I am sure they can fill you in on the details. A flywheel is an inertia storage device, not a damper. The purpose of the damper on the nose of the crank is to either shift the rotational frequency (engine rpm) at which catastrophic harmonics become evident out of the engine operating range, or to damp them such that they are no longer destructive. Mate, you can disagree with me, even tell me I am a d1ck-head full of sh1t, but 40 years of motorsport and the pain and disappointment of losing 3 cranks in one season taught me a hard lesson about harmonics, and that is knowledge that I respect. Now, the OP was told by his shop the proceed with care, and all I am doing is echoing those words of advice. I do not know what the implications for after-market pulleys actually are - they may be totally benign (and probably are) but if the OP wants to use his vehicle on the track or strip, I am simply saying buyer beware. There is no need to continue this thread .. because we are each accountable to ourselves for our own actions - I am not dictating to the OP, merely providing fact-based information that may, or may not, be pertinent to his post. He (and you) are always at liberty to ignore the statements and that is your right. As I said, tread your own path .... Mandingo, JARblue, Rusty and 2 others like this. Last edited by BGTV8; 12-05-2014 at 02:50 AM.

12-05-2014, 03:00 AM	#14 (permalink)
DEpointfive0 Premium Member Bitches Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: SoCal Posts: 14,824 Drives: a lot Rep Power: 17151	^I like you Since I have been informed that you Aussie's don't drink Foster's in Australia... If you ever make your way to the states, Foster's on me! Lol BGTV8 and Nut_N_Much like this. __________________ Do YOU want to know what/where I got my username from? ( Click to show/hide ) NSFW due to language:

12-05-2014, 03:34 AM	#15 (permalink)
1slow370 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: In the D Posts: 3,732 Drives: v8 74 260z ;) Rep Power: 7251	7500rpm with the factory balancer. __________________ ANSWER PRICE LIST Answers - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - $0.75 Answers (requiring thought) - - - - $1.25 Answers (correct) - - - - - - - - - - $12.50

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