Nissan 370Z Forum  

LSD on Sport Package

Curious, why does everyone knock the LSD on the 370? Thanks

Go Back   Nissan 370Z Forum > Nissan 370Z Tech Area > Engine & Drivetrain


Like Tree17Likes

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 08-24-2013, 04:21 PM   #1 (permalink)
Base Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: New Jersey
Age: 74
Posts: 97
Drives: 12 Vert Tour BS M6
Rep Power: 12
Jimc is on a distinguished road
Default LSD on Sport Package

Curious, why does everyone knock the LSD on the 370?

Thanks
Jimc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-24-2013, 04:31 PM   #2 (permalink)
A True Z Fanatic
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: NM
Posts: 8,063
Drives: Awedeeeeee
Rep Power: 602
Tigger has a reputation beyond reputeTigger has a reputation beyond reputeTigger has a reputation beyond reputeTigger has a reputation beyond reputeTigger has a reputation beyond reputeTigger has a reputation beyond reputeTigger has a reputation beyond reputeTigger has a reputation beyond reputeTigger has a reputation beyond reputeTigger has a reputation beyond reputeTigger has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Here's a nice write-up from wiki. Read the whole thing and you'll understand why. For true enthusiasts, like us, viscous couplings suck. In a way, in a very simply put way, it is like taking a torque converter and putting it in the rear. I'll keep my open diff over the stock LSD any day. Clutch-types are for the most part the best, depending on manufacturer of course.

"The viscous type is generally simpler because it relies on hydrodynamic friction from fluids with high viscosity. Silicone-based oils are often used. Here, a cylindrical chamber of fluid filled with a stack of perforated discs rotates with the normal motion of the output shafts. The inside surface of the chamber is coupled to one of the driveshafts, and the outside coupled to the differential carrier. Half of the discs are connected to the inner, the other half to the outer, alternating inner/outer in the stack. Differential motion forces the interleaved discs to move through the fluid against each other. In some viscous couplings when speed is maintained the fluid will accumulate heat due to friction. This heat will cause the fluid to expand, and expand the coupler causing the discs to be pulled together resulting in a non-viscous plate to plate friction and a dramatic drop in speed difference. This is known as the hump phenomenon and it allows the side of the coupler to gently lock. In contrast to the mechanical type, the limiting action is much softer and more proportional to the slip, and so is easier to cope with for the average driver. New Process Gear used a viscous coupling of the Ferguson style in several of their transfer cases including those used in the AMC Eagle.
Viscous LSDs are less efficient than mechanical types, that is, they "lose" some power. In particular, any sustained load which overheats the silicone results in sudden permanent loss of the differential effect.[6] They do have the virtue of failing gracefully, reverting to semi-open differential behavior. Typically a visco-differential that has covered 60,000 miles (97,000 km) or more will be functioning largely as an open differential;[citation needed] this is a known weakness of the original Mazda MX-5 (a.k.a. Miata) sports car. The silicone oil is factory sealed in a separate chamber from the gear oil surrounding the rest of the differential. This is not serviceable; when the differential's behavior deteriorates, the VLSD center must be replaced." - wikipedia
Jimc likes this.
Tigger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-24-2013, 04:34 PM   #3 (permalink)
A True Z Fanatic
 
TerribleONE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Socal
Posts: 10,203
Drives: WOT
Rep Power: 5850
TerribleONE has a reputation beyond reputeTerribleONE has a reputation beyond reputeTerribleONE has a reputation beyond reputeTerribleONE has a reputation beyond reputeTerribleONE has a reputation beyond reputeTerribleONE has a reputation beyond reputeTerribleONE has a reputation beyond reputeTerribleONE has a reputation beyond reputeTerribleONE has a reputation beyond reputeTerribleONE has a reputation beyond reputeTerribleONE has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Even though it is leaps and bounds better than the open diff, it is still not a great unit.. I know on my G37 (I have a non-sport Z with a OSG LSD) I would still get the inside tire to slip while pushing it really hard, and occasionally get engagement. For the average driver though the stock VLSD is pretty good..
__________________
638WHP 541WTQ @ 13.5PSI
Build thread
TerribleONE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-24-2013, 08:19 PM   #4 (permalink)
A True Z Fanatic
 
Felix 808's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Camarillo, CA
Posts: 1,063
Drives: 2011 PW/Grey T/S 7AT
Rep Power: 2807
Felix 808 has a reputation beyond reputeFelix 808 has a reputation beyond reputeFelix 808 has a reputation beyond reputeFelix 808 has a reputation beyond reputeFelix 808 has a reputation beyond reputeFelix 808 has a reputation beyond reputeFelix 808 has a reputation beyond reputeFelix 808 has a reputation beyond reputeFelix 808 has a reputation beyond reputeFelix 808 has a reputation beyond reputeFelix 808 has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TerribleONE View Post
Even though it is leaps and bounds better than the open diff, it is still not a great unit. For the average driver though the stock VLSD is pretty good..
The only way an open diff is better, is that it might be easier to swap in another unit & don't kid yourself, those super tight clutch packed units burn out too. I know when mine starts going, I'll be looking for a torsion type unit (Quaife)
370Zsteve likes this.
__________________
Semper Fi

Μολὼν λαβέ
Felix 808 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-2013, 01:37 AM   #5 (permalink)
Track Member
 
Mozen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Newport News, VA
Posts: 820
Drives: Nissan 370z PW M6
Rep Power: 18
Mozen has a reputation beyond reputeMozen has a reputation beyond reputeMozen has a reputation beyond reputeMozen has a reputation beyond reputeMozen has a reputation beyond reputeMozen has a reputation beyond reputeMozen has a reputation beyond reputeMozen has a reputation beyond reputeMozen has a reputation beyond reputeMozen has a reputation beyond reputeMozen has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Felix 808 View Post
The only way an open diff is better, is that it might be easier to swap in another unit & don't kid yourself, those super tight clutch packed units burn out too. I know when mine starts going, I'll be looking for a torsion type unit (Quaife)

Thats the problem i am having with my Carbonetics, constant need of rebuild. Ive had it on the car for 30k miles, id say 200 of which are track/hard use. I have had to get it reshimmed twice and now im fairly sure it needs a full rebuild. Mind you this is with me changing fluid religiously every 3k miles or After a track/race event. Install and work was done by SSA in Houston so i know it wasnt me f-in anything up.
__________________
PW 370z | AEM | MISHIMOTO | ARK PERFORMANCE | WHITELINE | NISMO | STILLEN | FORGESTAR | BC RACING | AMS | NON STOP TUNING | CARBONETICS LSD | 4 Point DOM 1.75" SCCA Spec Roll Bar + Harness Bar
CHECK OUT MY BUILD THREAD HERE
Mozen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-2013, 09:35 AM   #6 (permalink)
Track Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Singapore
Posts: 861
Drives: 370z,Yellow,7sp A
Rep Power: 17
Chan Chee Hoe is on a distinguished road
Default

The last service,my service centre changed the rear Diff oil,i think they used the wrong type of oil,it became an "Open Diff",just last week,i changed to "Cusco VLSD" Gear oil.....the feeling are not the same,esp power during conering..
Chan Chee Hoe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-2013, 07:00 PM   #7 (permalink)
A True Z Fanatic
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: N/A
Posts: 76,801
Drives: N/A
Rep Power: 141521
kenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimc View Post
Curious, why does everyone knock the LSD on the 370?

Thanks
because most people do more car forum driving vs real world driving.

the VLSD is fine for me. works great.
6spd, 370Zsteve, PapoZalsa and 1 others like this.
kenchan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-2013, 07:16 PM   #8 (permalink)
A True Z Fanatic
 
SPOHN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Covington, GA
Age: 45
Posts: 14,844
Drives: Waiting on next Z
Rep Power: 221
SPOHN has a reputation beyond reputeSPOHN has a reputation beyond reputeSPOHN has a reputation beyond reputeSPOHN has a reputation beyond reputeSPOHN has a reputation beyond reputeSPOHN has a reputation beyond reputeSPOHN has a reputation beyond reputeSPOHN has a reputation beyond reputeSPOHN has a reputation beyond reputeSPOHN has a reputation beyond reputeSPOHN has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Great till it gets hot.
__________________
SPOHN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-2013, 07:22 PM   #9 (permalink)
A True Z Fanatic
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: N/A
Posts: 76,801
Drives: N/A
Rep Power: 141521
kenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SPOHN View Post
Great till it gets hot.
you track your car, you should get a LSD to begin with.
kenchan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-2013, 07:30 PM   #10 (permalink)
Track Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Singapore
Posts: 861
Drives: 370z,Yellow,7sp A
Rep Power: 17
Chan Chee Hoe is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SPOHN View Post
Great till it gets hot.
My daily driving about 25 km....just nice...
Chan Chee Hoe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-2013, 07:41 PM   #11 (permalink)
A True Z Fanatic
 
SPOHN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Covington, GA
Age: 45
Posts: 14,844
Drives: Waiting on next Z
Rep Power: 221
SPOHN has a reputation beyond reputeSPOHN has a reputation beyond reputeSPOHN has a reputation beyond reputeSPOHN has a reputation beyond reputeSPOHN has a reputation beyond reputeSPOHN has a reputation beyond reputeSPOHN has a reputation beyond reputeSPOHN has a reputation beyond reputeSPOHN has a reputation beyond reputeSPOHN has a reputation beyond reputeSPOHN has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kenchan View Post
you track your car, you should get a LSD to begin with.
I do. OS Giken baby
Tigger likes this.
__________________
SPOHN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-2013, 08:02 PM   #12 (permalink)
A True Z Fanatic
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: N/A
Posts: 76,801
Drives: N/A
Rep Power: 141521
kenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SPOHN View Post
I do. OS Giken baby
so i still dont get your point spohn. go work on your turbo or something.

370Zsteve and SPOHN like this.
kenchan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-2013, 09:46 PM   #13 (permalink)
The370Z.com Sponsor
 
Mike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Loganville, GA
Posts: 5,944
Drives: 370z
Rep Power: 2186
Mike has a reputation beyond reputeMike has a reputation beyond reputeMike has a reputation beyond reputeMike has a reputation beyond reputeMike has a reputation beyond reputeMike has a reputation beyond reputeMike has a reputation beyond reputeMike has a reputation beyond reputeMike has a reputation beyond reputeMike has a reputation beyond reputeMike has a reputation beyond repute
Default

I think he is saying that for the street, the VLSD is fine.
__________________
NISSAN: 75 280Z / 86 300ZX GLL /87 Sentra SE / 03 350Z / 23 Z
Porsche: 93 968 / 23 Macan GTS / 93 968
Mike is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2013, 11:33 AM   #14 (permalink)
A True Z Fanatic
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: NM
Posts: 8,063
Drives: Awedeeeeee
Rep Power: 602
Tigger has a reputation beyond reputeTigger has a reputation beyond reputeTigger has a reputation beyond reputeTigger has a reputation beyond reputeTigger has a reputation beyond reputeTigger has a reputation beyond reputeTigger has a reputation beyond reputeTigger has a reputation beyond reputeTigger has a reputation beyond reputeTigger has a reputation beyond reputeTigger has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Let's play the other side of the coin, shall we? I'm not trying to advocate an open diff (just because I have a base model) but for the street, even an open diff is fine because if you are driving hard enough on the street to really get any use out of a VLSD, ELSD, Clutch-type LSD or any other variant, you probably belong in jail.

If you plan on a track day here or there then sure, the VLSD will help. I planned on the OSG myself which is why I got the base model to begin with. To each their own. But for daily driving even the VLSD is nearly pointless.
Tigger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2013, 11:51 AM   #15 (permalink)
A True Z Fanatic
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: N/A
Posts: 76,801
Drives: N/A
Rep Power: 141521
kenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond reputekenchan has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike View Post
I think he is saying that for the street, the VLSD is fine.
thanks for the translation, mike. .. we just kidding around.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
Let's play the other side of the coin, shall we? I'm not trying to advocate an open diff (just because I have a base model) but for the street, even an open diff is fine because if you are driving hard enough on the street to really get any use out of a VLSD, ELSD, Clutch-type LSD or any other variant, you probably belong in jail.

If you plan on a track day here or there then sure, the VLSD will help. I planned on the OSG myself which is why I got the base model to begin with. To each their own. But for daily driving even the VLSD is nearly pointless.
ive not driven the open diff Z so can't say for sure, but as long as your suspension is tuned to your car and your tires, it should be able to compensate for the limitation for street use.

ive had cars in the past where open diff was very obvious and problematic when driving out of a sharp quick turn. but i was able to reduce it considerably by planting the car better using swaybars and some suspension tuning, offset changes.

that said, some folks go all out with suspension mods without considering the VLSD, VDC, ABS program. they all work with the dynamics of the car so if you do dramatic changes without much thought, it will make the car drive worse and slower...

another reason why ive not changed much of the car this time around.
kenchan is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
[FOR SALE] Michelin Pilot Sport A/S tires for Sport Package wackjum Parts for sale (Private Classifieds) 15 12-26-2013 04:53 AM
Canadian White 370z Sport Package-Touring Package-Loaded atki 370Z For Sale 6 03-08-2011 09:49 PM
rear appearance between sport and no sport package 소녀시대 Exterior & Interior 2 02-26-2010 12:38 AM
370Z get sport package or no sport package? steven88 Nissan 370Z General Discussions 64 09-20-2009 08:11 PM
Sport Package Brake Test vs Non-Sport Package hey32g Nissan 370Z General Discussions 9 04-12-2009 12:23 AM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:09 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2