Stay NA or go to the Dark Side?

Kingbaby

It's because we are currently NA in stock form...VQHR guy here and NA guys are already into 100k club, and they are not pussy footing around in it either! I have 39k of hard street driving....if I'd had done the same on a boosted application, I doubt it would've made it to 39k.

On the other note....GTM kits installed correctly with reasonable boost are also lasting the test of time also....


So it goes both ways!


NA has a little more pride it in...



OP don't forget gears/TUNE/100shot

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07 Silver Alloy Nissan 350Z Nismo #0191 "Lin'da"
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Red__Zed

Built NA != stock NA

ZKraken22

So adding FI to a NA car is more reliable? So im seeing more guys with z's and G's adding Strokers along with a FI kit. Why are they doing that? to make the car more reliable! buddies na mustang with 135K... Cam, heads you name it and the car still runs. He is still in college he has needed a tune and new spark plugs a year ago and the car is still running. Let me see a boosted car last a year needing a re tune. The car that Megan370z posted im not telling OP to run anything like that. more like gabe3d over at (my350z) with the Stroker, cam G35 who has 100 miles on the engine. NA is reliable.

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Litespeed Racing Titanium Cold Air intake// GT Haus Axle// GarageLine combo// Nismo sway bars// Nismo Spoiler // Berk TP's

ZKraken22

NA with JUN Cams and existing mods 1st place!!!!!!
(as of now)

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Litespeed Racing Titanium Cold Air intake// GT Haus Axle// GarageLine combo// Nismo sway bars// Nismo Spoiler // Berk TP's

Red__Zed

Are you serious? They are adding a stroker on top of FI to make more power. There's still no replacement for displacement, and a stroked motor is fantastic for producing torque.


I didn't stroke my motor for reliability...I did it for POWER



a) apples and oranges
b) happens all the time, especially when you are only picking up a couple of horses



There are only a couple of ways to increase power...it pretty much comes down to trying to make air and fuel mix better. FI does this pretty easily-- you take your engine and you cram more air down it's gullet. If your goal isn't big power, you can still run an OEM-style tune, and keep things perfectly reliable.

To get results of a similar magnitude from an NA build, you are having to run an extremely aggressive tune that kills driveability and generates a whole ton of extra heat to deal with. You are fundamentally limited by atmospheric pressure, and this leaves you no other option than trying to get closer to the edge. It comes down to basic chemistry and physics.


The only way an "NA build" is going to be more reliable than an FI build is if:

A) you put together a crappy FI system
B) you are talking low-dollar, low-power builds (ie, bolt-ons)

Kingbaby

For the average Z owner yes! All bolt-ons/a tune/supporting mods is what I'm talking about I rarely see folks dive into a small engine build due to the minimal gains seen from cams or anything else.

Haven't seen/followed your build...do you still drive with the same confidence?

I'm not trying take anything away from boost, it's just the way a boosted Z car is driven 9 out of 10 times is sadden that's all.

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07 Silver Alloy Nissan 350Z Nismo #0191 "Lin'da"
2amR--------------------> VQ I.N.C. - Like us!

SS_Firehawk

Both NA and FI have proven reliable, given a proper budget and knowledge. IF that were not the case, half the new cars coming out wouldn't be small displacement and turbo'd. It's all a big physics game. Not every motor needs to run a closed deck and low compression to run forced induction. But damn near every motor will have to be re engineered if that boost is turned way up. Keep boost pressure low, improve flow, and you get more performance per psi. Driveline reliability, good luck to those half shafts if your tires hook up. Our motor's as will only get so far without increasing displacement in naturally aspirated form. There are really only a couple things left to do. Exhaust cams, VVEL, increase compression, and octane. We don't have the luxury of Direct Injection. The JUN cam's don't seem like they are going to make a drastic difference looking at the specs. I'm sure I can get some custom ground ones taking it up just a bit further. Our Heads have a lot of unlocked potential if we could ever figure out how to take advantage of them.increasing compression doesn't make sense, because if we are going that deep, we might as well increase displacement. Regarding octane, E85, that's as easy as replacing a fuel pump, lines (if necessary), new injectors, and a tune. I like both options and they have their advantages and disadvantages. And thank the Car Gods we have a tuner market supporting both!

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Navyboy916

You know see a lot of good arguments but those people who have voted for the jun cams why don't you get the cams and get them installed. So far I am the only one so far that is getting these installed. There are great discussions for both sides. This is a good thread. I don't expect massive gains from getting these cams installed and this is.and sucks so bad they don't have a dyno here so I can't post numbers but I will show video so you guys can see it. My car is going in next week to get them installed so stay tuned....

ZKraken22

firehawk? so what are you leaning toward? And believe me i would have been the first to get the jun cams if i had the money its not about waiting to see someone else do it it's about cash flow. Lost my job. Thank God for savings. I hope one day ill be starting a thread about having a NA stroker Z

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Litespeed Racing Titanium Cold Air intake// GT Haus Axle// GarageLine combo// Nismo sway bars// Nismo Spoiler // Berk TP's

SS_Firehawk

I'm still a bit up in the air on it all. But talking with GTM, their twin charger kit is sounding the more enticing route regarding FI options. I think if I were to do FI, I would do that. Labor would be less than the TT specifically because I don't need to touch anything on the exhaust. My shop cringes at the word "headers" and this car. I don't think I would run the tandem oil cooler like GTM recommended, mine is F'n large. I would rather use that money on something else. I know full install cost on this would be around $1500 including tuning if needed.

But I keep being drawn back by NA because it is the least expensive option. It allows me to focus on other aspects of the vehicle besides the engine. The two biggest things are flywheel/clutch and a new diff. Brake upgrades are minor, and I consider the suspension as the best thing they got right from the factory. Tires alone go a long way with this car. I think overall it would be the better car at this point, but would only bring it up to par with the likes of other track duty cars coming from the factory like Boss 302's and 1LE equipped Camaro's.

I'm still up in the air on it all. I haven't heard the definitive argument for one or the other. If there was a way to put together a stroker Z within my budget though...

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SS_Firehawk

Noticed this morning that GTM lists JUN cams on their website for order now. They are selling it for $699. Doing the math, trying to purchase directly from JUN was $640ish. With the changing exchange rates and hassle of ordering, a $60.00 difference isn't bad.

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Kingbaby

*wispers softly*




Do it

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07 Silver Alloy Nissan 350Z Nismo #0191 "Lin'da"
2amR--------------------> VQ I.N.C. - Like us!

SS_Firehawk

Well my Bday is next month, and my sisters punk *** just got an Ipad 3 from the folks, (our family still goes out of the way to get gifts for each other [and I'm turning 30...] I think a little group effort on this won't hurt :P I'm out of country still, so even if I do buy it now, it won't be until either December or when I return before they are installed. Wait.... LIGHTBULB. (in a "Despicable Me voice"). I kinda like the sound of December. I'm supposed to be home on vacation for about 10 days.

Regardless if I go boost, the increased overlap shouldn't affect it much when running under 10 psi. It would be breathing better, so there would be less pressure overall, but the power will still be there. I would have to take it to my local shop to have it done within a reasonable time. They quoted me $1500 for the twin SC install based on what they saw on the forums. That was a pretty good deal. On the other hand, they do specialize in FI. I think I just may do that. I'll get my spark plugs replaced while they are at it.

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wheee!

ummmm you forgot the Boosted Performance mid mount twin scroll turbo kit..... That's the only way I would go IF I went turbo....

Boosted Performance single turbo build

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SS_Firehawk

Indeed, someone else mentioned as well. Haven't followed single turbo's much, I don't care much about STS's implementation of it. I'll follow the updates and see how it pans out.

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