South Bend Clutch-bad install

Joe@ZSpeed · 02-16-2012, 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OKC Z

Its definitely louder while driving low speeds and gears. But quiet at idle. For example 33mph in 5th clatter/ LIKE grinding noise but once car hits 2500-2600 rpms or 40 mph over all noise goes away. But after driving around a while the idle clatter is minimal.
Thanks.

Give me a call this eve, I have some info for you that will help with the bleeding issue. I found today where the air is getting trapped.
I tore my entire car down today and started from scratch much like you guys do to see what was going on with the bleeding and learned much from it.

I have had mine apart so many times before when setting all this up I wanted to go right from scratch so I can better help you all out. Went very well

SPOHN · 02-16-2012, 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe@ZSpeed

Give me a call this eve, I have some info for you that will help with the bleeding issue. I found today where the air is getting trapped.
I tore my entire car down today and started from scratch much like you guys do to see what was going on with the bleeding and learned much from it.

I have had mine apart so many times before when setting all this up I wanted to go right from scratch so I can better help you all out. Went very well

Can you share that info for all?

Joe@ZSpeed · 02-16-2012, 07:57 PM

I found that the air is trapped at the master and believe this has been the issue for some of the guys in the 370Z, The HR 350'z don't seem to have much trouble bleeding the systems nor have I in those older models but the line set-ups are slightly different between the 2 cars.

I started with everything in stock position, Pedal adjustment ect.

I drained the system of fluid like you would when installing everything.

I then let it gravity bleed for about 20-25 minutes.

I tried the clutch and had some pressure at about half way point down, with quite a bit of slop at the top and a pedal that did not want to return all the way at times. Pump bled it a few times which seemed to actually make it worse.

At this point the system should have not had air but I knew it did.

I started breaking line connections loose in the left inner fender area to see if any air was present by watching the fluid come out of the nut part of the line. I did not find any here.

I then took the cover off above the master, Broke the line loose at the master cylinder about half way out until I saw fluid come out (Dropped the wrench and spent a good 20 minutes fishing it out later of the abyss down there (Hint, Do not drop wrench)

I then watched it for about 2-3 minutes as the air kept coming and spitting out of the connection. After about 2-3 minutes the air stopped coming out and turned to clear fluid, At this time I knew I had found the source of trapped air which will not bleed out easily no matter how long you spend pump bleeding it.

Tried the clutch again with much better results, Still had a bit if non return, kinda lazy coming back from about the 3/4 up position. I adjusted the master rod at the pedal until the threads are just about flush, or slightly below the back of the clevis nut (seat side) on the pedal. Pedal is now perfect with perfect return. You must retain some free play in the clevis, you cannot get the adjustment too tight.

I have now drove the car for about an hour total today and it is perfect. Perfect release, Perfect engagement, About half way in the up travel.

The TZR with the new DXD black flywheel is incredible

Going from the heavier original southbend flywheel to the new lighter "Black" flywheel with the unsprung TZR clutch changed this car 100% taking of from a stop, I can actually take off now with out the stupid jerking like the stock clutch or replacement with sprung hub does. I found it almost impossible to take off smooth with the original stock clutch and DM flywheel, It got better with the last kit and original DXD flywheel but this is just a whole new animal and I am loving it.

I have this TZR in my 90 Twin Turbo also and really like it in that car, I am blown away with it in the 370. It is perfectly smooth from the get go and shifts incredible.

OKC Z · 05-03-2012, 06:47 AM

I finally got my car in the Nissan shop to get the ECM replaced and while it was there I had them do a complete clutch flush. They called it brake flush. I told them I had the clutch replaced and believed there was air trapped in the master or somewhere in the system. Long story short I fought them a little but they got it done and Im in love with the south bend clutch. I always like how quick it was to grab and how it worked but not the way it felt. Well now no more air. The pedal is firm, responsive, no more dead spots, spongy pedal, and goes into gear alot smoother. It cost me $132 with tax which i think its well worth it. I found out it had DOT 3 instead of DOT 4 thats why it would feel worst after driving the car in 80° + temperatures. So in conclusion it was a bad install cause of the wrong fluid and not properly bled. Thanks Joe for everything and for finding out what problem was.

Joe@ZSpeed · 05-03-2012, 10:14 AM

Great to hear! You can use DOT 4 fluid in them, DOT 3 and DOT 4 are compatible, You just don't want to use a silicone based DOT 5 fluid.

RyanWest · 05-03-2012, 09:37 PM

southbend clutch sucked on my subaru. extreme shake and noise when coming out of 1st.

Joe@ZSpeed · 05-03-2012, 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RyanWest

southbend clutch sucked on my subaru. extreme shake and noise when coming out of 1st.

What clutch did you have? How they drive is totally dependent on the type of clutch material you choose. Often times people make the mistake of choosing the wrong clutch for there needs/wants and is why I always recommend if you are not sure what you need to call and ask before purchasing.

thsxtreme · 10-01-2014, 07:25 PM

I am so glad I read this. I was wondering about the shutter/grind like noise coming out of 1st and 2nd at very low RPMS. I barely hear it over 2000 rpms.

370z_2910 · 07-06-2015, 07:07 AM

I've recently also installed the south bend daily kit package for my z.

after 1000 km, the clutch feel slippage at high rpm and not really that grabby.

also, i'm losing power at 3000 rpm for few seconds (not always).

is it normal? or do i need to break in again?

02-16-2012, 07:57 PM	#18 (permalink)
Joe@ZSpeed A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Ohio Posts: 1,304 Drives: Nissan Rep Power: 342999	I found that the air is trapped at the master and believe this has been the issue for some of the guys in the 370Z, The HR 350'z don't seem to have much trouble bleeding the systems nor have I in those older models but the line set-ups are slightly different between the 2 cars. I started with everything in stock position, Pedal adjustment ect. I drained the system of fluid like you would when installing everything. I then let it gravity bleed for about 20-25 minutes. I tried the clutch and had some pressure at about half way point down, with quite a bit of slop at the top and a pedal that did not want to return all the way at times. Pump bled it a few times which seemed to actually make it worse. At this point the system should have not had air but I knew it did. I started breaking line connections loose in the left inner fender area to see if any air was present by watching the fluid come out of the nut part of the line. I did not find any here. I then took the cover off above the master, Broke the line loose at the master cylinder about half way out until I saw fluid come out (Dropped the wrench and spent a good 20 minutes fishing it out later of the abyss down there (Hint, Do not drop wrench) I then watched it for about 2-3 minutes as the air kept coming and spitting out of the connection. After about 2-3 minutes the air stopped coming out and turned to clear fluid, At this time I knew I had found the source of trapped air which will not bleed out easily no matter how long you spend pump bleeding it. Tried the clutch again with much better results, Still had a bit if non return, kinda lazy coming back from about the 3/4 up position. I adjusted the master rod at the pedal until the threads are just about flush, or slightly below the back of the clevis nut (seat side) on the pedal. Pedal is now perfect with perfect return. You must retain some free play in the clevis, you cannot get the adjustment too tight. I have now drove the car for about an hour total today and it is perfect. Perfect release, Perfect engagement, About half way in the up travel. The TZR with the new DXD black flywheel is incredible Going from the heavier original southbend flywheel to the new lighter "Black" flywheel with the unsprung TZR clutch changed this car 100% taking of from a stop, I can actually take off now with out the stupid jerking like the stock clutch or replacement with sprung hub does. I found it almost impossible to take off smooth with the original stock clutch and DM flywheel, It got better with the last kit and original DXD flywheel but this is just a whole new animal and I am loving it. I have this TZR in my 90 Twin Turbo also and really like it in that car, I am blown away with it in the 370. It is perfectly smooth from the get go and shifts incredible. SwedeZ likes this. __________________ http://photos.zspeedperformance.com/...ardsize=468x60 Phone *937-506-7224* E-Mail Sales@Zspeed.com www.ZSPEED.com Last edited by Joe@ZSpeed; 04-28-2012 at 09:26 AM.

05-03-2012, 06:47 AM	#19 (permalink)
OKC Z Base Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: OKC Posts: 205 Drives: '09 370z-$old 9/1/12 Rep Power: 14	I finally got my car in the Nissan shop to get the ECM replaced and while it was there I had them do a complete clutch flush. They called it brake flush. I told them I had the clutch replaced and believed there was air trapped in the master or somewhere in the system. Long story short I fought them a little but they got it done and Im in love with the south bend clutch. I always like how quick it was to grab and how it worked but not the way it felt. Well now no more air. The pedal is firm, responsive, no more dead spots, spongy pedal, and goes into gear alot smoother. It cost me $132 with tax which i think its well worth it. I found out it had DOT 3 instead of DOT 4 thats why it would feel worst after driving the car in 80° + temperatures. So in conclusion it was a bad install cause of the wrong fluid and not properly bled. Thanks Joe for everything and for finding out what problem was. SwedeZ likes this.

05-03-2012, 10:14 AM	#20 (permalink)
Joe@ZSpeed A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Ohio Posts: 1,304 Drives: Nissan Rep Power: 342999	Great to hear! You can use DOT 4 fluid in them, DOT 3 and DOT 4 are compatible, You just don't want to use a silicone based DOT 5 fluid. __________________ http://photos.zspeedperformance.com/...ardsize=468x60 Phone *937-506-7224* E-Mail Sales@Zspeed.com www.ZSPEED.com

07-06-2015, 07:07 AM	#24 (permalink)
370z_2910 Base Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: BRUNEI Posts: 127 Drives: 370Z Rep Power: 16	I've recently also installed the south bend daily kit package for my z. after 1000 km, the clutch feel slippage at high rpm and not really that grabby. also, i'm losing power at 3000 rpm for few seconds (not always). is it normal? or do i need to break in again? Last edited by 370z_2910; 07-06-2015 at 07:12 AM.

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05-03-2012, 09:37 PM	#21 (permalink)
RyanWest Track Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Tamp, Fl Posts: 714 Drives: 2009 Nissan Rep Power: 33	southbend clutch sucked on my subaru. extreme shake and noise when coming out of 1st.

10-01-2014, 07:25 PM	#23 (permalink)
thsxtreme Base Member Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 3 Drives: 2009 370z base+sport Rep Power: 11	I am so glad I read this. I was wondering about the shutter/grind like noise coming out of 1st and 2nd at very low RPMS. I barely hear it over 2000 rpms.