Everyone with oil temp issues

TheWeatherman · 05-19-2009, 02:35 PM

Okay folks. Just got off the phone with someone a step up from my Midwest Regional CS Manager. First, this person races cars for fun. He races street cars. His favorite track is Road America in Wisconsin. This guy knows his stuff. He's not a kid and has been doing this a long time. 250 to 280 to him is optimal engine oil temperature for high performance driving, and he urged anyone to just look it up from reputable sources. Also, I must say, this person could not have been nicer. They're motto right now is "prove it on the street." The racetrack is a different story. This we should completely understand. This oil cooler kit is coming out for all of the people complaining for an issue that most of us have never had. (I got to the 260-280, after a 'spirited driving' session, but it never cut itself off or limited anything.)

If it's not cutting off, it's running just fine. He said those of you trying to race your cars around at the much much cooler temperatures (ie. 180-200) are the ones actually not doing the engine any favors. This is some more VERY important information.

You hit 300, you're in a bit of trouble, but that's where the engine will automatically limit itself. It's not the complete end of the earth nor the engine. He said if you are racing, they will have your ultimate oil cooler kit that is thermostatically controlled. That's nice. It's just about out, and wait for it. Would it have been nice to have this option earlier this year? Of course. He stressed over and over, your oil should be between 250 to 280 for its best protection of the engine in high performance driving. If you're not hitting the cut-off, the engine is by no means in danger.

Should you choose to buy the Nissan Motorsports Oil Cooler kit, which I'm sure most of us are, get it done at the Nissan dealer. He said that will keep your full powertrain warranty in tact.

This should start putting this to rest. I believe him completely. He was very, very nice. I want you all to read what I have posted above a couple of times. 250-280 is good for a motor being run hard. You have to be well above this range for it to break down. He also said the Nissan Ester oil is perfect in this range. He said if you're on a track and are experiencing this, your fix is coming, but otherwise if your engine doesn't go into a full limp mode, it's doing fine. He said they've pounded the piss out of these cars, and know it takes an awful lot to have the motor go into limp mode. I agree. He even urged me to take him out on our roads in "A spirited way." He races street legal race cars on tracks people, and personally had a hand in R&D. Do you know these have been out testing for almost three years before they came out? He said they flogged the hell out of them. Up mountains, in the Arizona desert, and never had these problems. He said if you are racing them, well, your oil cooler is just about out. He said just to make sure, the thermostat will keep the temps in this "hot" optimal range.

Almost all of our cars are just fine and are not compromised in any way. If you race them on a track for quite a while, all out, he said they understand. Your temperature controlled coolers are coming out.

Chupacabra · 05-19-2009, 03:08 PM

I had a minor feeling it was 'designed' this way, being as the 200 mark is in the middle of the clock.

but. I used to work for a Grand American Rolex DP team, and we where up in Arizona, practice in the car, the oil temp it 250-260 and it lose of seals, oil all over the place, and some fuel hoses melted. That is the only reason I am concerned.

SoCal 370Z · 05-19-2009, 03:11 PM

Well, that's all very, very nice, but look at what Nissan Japan is stating about the GT-R service intervals: Nissan Japan Lowers the Cost of GT-R Maintenance. Granted this is the GT-R engine, but at 266 F Nissan is stating to change your oil "As soon as possible." Sorry, not buying the Midwest Regional CS Manager's position (and it is not from Japan proper), but I am stating this in a nice way. If our engine goes deep six without an oil cooler as this appears to be an "option" and we are using our Z only as a daily driver, then Nissan shall be obligated to replace my engine under warranty.

TheWeatherman · 05-19-2009, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chupacabra

I had a minor feeling it was 'designed' this way, being as the 200 mark is in the middle of the clock.

but. I used to work for a Grand American Rolex DP team, and we where up in Arizona, practice in the car, the oil temp it 250-260 and it lose of seals, oil all over the place, and some fuel hoses melted. That is the only reason I am concerned.

Yeah, that's why he said, "Run our ester oil, and you'll be problem free. It was designed for those temperatures. We know it does it. That's what it's supposed to do unless you are on a racetrack. That's why we're coming out with our fully warranted oil cooling kit." I actually liked how he said this... "If you're going to flog it, get it hot first. That's what we designed it to do so you guys don't damage any componentry." I'm afraid to say it, but I believe he's right.

And SoCal, I think he made it clear that we will be okay, no matter what your temps. He asked us to have confidence in their product. They know what it should and shoudn't do. I say this respectfully to you, hearing your side. (Personally, I think these motors are going to run forever, no matter what temps we're running. Okay, not forever, but ya know what I mean.

Let's enjoy our cars and have some faith in the company. I love mine to death!

SoCal 370Z · 05-19-2009, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheWeatherman

Yeah, that's why he said, "Run our ester oil, and you'll be problem free. It was designed for those temperatures. We know it does it. That's what it's supposed to do unless you are on a racetrack. That's why we're coming out with our fully warranted oil cooling kit." I actually liked how he said this... "If you're going to flog it, get it hot first. That's what we designed it to do so you guys don't damage any componentry." I'm afraid to say it, but I believe he's right.

Sorry, this is not from Japan so I place little credence on it. I appreciate your post, but if Nissan is now saying—and contradicting their own 370Z owners manual regarding the oil that can be used—then they should have done so as a full disclosure on the Monroney, in their owners manual, and at the time of closing—all in writing. I can also assure you that the person you spoke with has no authority in said matters, unless it has officially been handed-down from Corporate Japan; in such case there will be a document with their recommendation.

SoCal 370Z · 05-19-2009, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheWeatherman

And SoCal, I think he made it clear that we will be okay, no matter what your temps.

I already distrust him. There is a science to oil and if he is above said science then he'd better have developed newer lubricants that will tolerate "any temperatures."

Modshack · 05-19-2009, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoCal 370Z

I already distrust him. There is a science to oil and if he is above said science then he'd better have developed newer lubricants that will tolerate "any temperatures."

One man's "opinion" does not make it so....

Forrest · 05-19-2009, 04:15 PM

i highly agree with SoCal 370Z.

Logicly none of it is making sence. Its like saying nissan figured out getting your oil to run 300degree makes for a better race car and everybody else is stupid who trys to keep there oil coiler.

mannyz · 05-19-2009, 05:27 PM

I do understand where Nissan is coming from. They are just telling you that unless you are beating the hell out of the car, you will not get into the limb mode or shutdown, but if you do then you need to get the Oil Cooler. In othe words if you dont want your car to shutdown, drive it sloooowwwwllly!

I know when I talk to the Manager at the dealer he will tell me the same thing, but I already got an answer. Why will I get a Z, or GTR, or Corvette, etc if I cannot drive it as a sport car, if this is the reasoning behind the people who make the cars, then they should stop making sport cars, and that will force me to get a Prius, or Fusion, or a Hybrid car.

I still think, like everyone else, they should included the Oil Cooler, they made a Sport car, they should have more protection other than just ECU controlled. But thats my Opinion

I am a computer business man, is like if you want me to build you a gaming computer, and after heating problems I tell you "yea, you can play games, but no more than 2 hours, you need to let the computer rest, shut it down, wait an hour, then play for 2 more hours" o_O

SoCal 370Z · 05-19-2009, 05:30 PM

Nissan's official statement regarding overheating: Trailer queen.

wstar · 05-19-2009, 05:47 PM

Well, I think the tell-tale piece of data here, as soon as we can acquire it, is the temperature setting they choose for the Nismo oil cooler option. If the above quotes via Weatherman are actually on the money, their thermostat must be at 230-240-ish rather than the 180 that's been discussed here.

TheWeatherman · 05-19-2009, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wstar

Well, I think the tell-tale piece of data here, as soon as we can acquire it, is the temperature setting they choose for the Nismo oil cooler option. If the above quotes via Weatherman are actually on the money, their thermostat must be at 230-240-ish rather than the 180 that's been discussed here.

Yeah, I'm thinking that's when you're pounding on it though. When you're not, it's just not going to get that hot. It will protect it when you fly, and leave it run cool, as is, when cruising.

wstar · 05-19-2009, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheWeatherman

Yeah, I'm thinking that's when you're pounding on it though. When you're not, it's just not going to get that hot. It will protect it when you fly, and leave it run cool, as is, when cruising.

Are you saying you don't think they'd up the thermo temp given what you were told? We've seen pics of the Nismo core, it looks larger than Stillen's. A larger core with only a 180 thermo would easily keep the car at 200-212-ish and below in any reasonable kind of driving, and then when the daily driver does his limited spurts of performance driving, the temps would hardly have the chance to get up to more than say 230 before it was over. Even at the track, you'd have to do some pretty mean warmup to get up to 250+ for the ideal temps your Nissan guy was talking about.

To me this doesn't seem to add up with his statements about how banging on the engine with colder oil (what we consider normal, 180-220-ish, with spurts to 240 perhaps under hard conditions) is more detrimental than letting it run hot (250-280-ish).

So all I'm saying is, I expect the Nismo cooler option to have a thermo, and for that thermo to be set significantly higher than 180, for any of this to make sense. 220 would be reasonable, maybe 230-240 though given what he's saying.

My gut feeling is that their thermo, if any, will be at 180 and invalidate the guy, but I could be wrong.

wstar · 05-19-2009, 06:32 PM

Just read SoCal's GTR link too. They're stating an extended oil drain interval if you keep the oil under 230, a shorter (but reasonable) one if your oil is running in the 230-266 range, and 'change as soon as possible' if you break 266. Different engine (and different recommended oil), but it's still Nissan, it's still based on the same platform, and those numbers look a lot more reasonable and normal to me than the idea that 250-280 is 'ideal' for our engines when running hard.

spearfish25 · 05-19-2009, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wstar

My gut feeling is that their thermo, if any, will be at 180 and invalidate the guy, but I could be wrong.

Well, a bit more time and we'll have many of these answers. Don't overlook one very important piece of information TheWeatherman got for us. They are saying the Nismo Oil Cooler will be dealer installed and fully warranteed. Even if I have to pay for it out of pocket, that's a victory in itself.

05-19-2009, 03:08 PM	#512 (permalink)
Chupacabra Enthusiast Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Weston, Florida Posts: 477 Drives: 09 Nissan 370z s M6 Rep Power: 200	I had a minor feeling it was 'designed' this way, being as the 200 mark is in the middle of the clock. but. I used to work for a Grand American Rolex DP team, and we where up in Arizona, practice in the car, the oil temp it 250-260 and it lose of seals, oil all over the place, and some fuel hoses melted. That is the only reason I am concerned. __________________ Where are my aluminum pedals?

05-19-2009, 03:11 PM	#513 (permalink)
SoCal 370Z A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: US of A Posts: 2,842 Drives: Answers Rep Power: 33	Well, that's all very, very nice, but look at what Nissan Japan is stating about the GT-R service intervals: Nissan Japan Lowers the Cost of GT-R Maintenance. Granted this is the GT-R engine, but at 266 F Nissan is stating to change your oil "As soon as possible." Sorry, not buying the Midwest Regional CS Manager's position (and it is not from Japan proper), but I am stating this in a nice way. If our engine goes deep six without an oil cooler as this appears to be an "option" and we are using our Z only as a daily driver, then Nissan shall be obligated to replace my engine under warranty. __________________ ( Click to show/hide ) Why I NEVER say NO to the Panda Lou Fusz!!!

05-19-2009, 05:30 PM	#520 (permalink)
SoCal 370Z A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: US of A Posts: 2,842 Drives: Answers Rep Power: 33	Nissan's official statement regarding overheating: Trailer queen. __________________ ( Click to show/hide ) Why I NEVER say NO to the Panda Lou Fusz!!!

05-19-2009, 05:47 PM	#521 (permalink)
wstar A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 4,024 Drives: too slow Rep Power: 3594	Well, I think the tell-tale piece of data here, as soon as we can acquire it, is the temperature setting they choose for the Nismo oil cooler option. If the above quotes via Weatherman are actually on the money, their thermostat must be at 230-240-ish rather than the 180 that's been discussed here. __________________ 7AT Track Car! Journal thread / Car setup details

05-19-2009, 06:32 PM	#524 (permalink)
wstar A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 4,024 Drives: too slow Rep Power: 3594	Just read SoCal's GTR link too. They're stating an extended oil drain interval if you keep the oil under 230, a shorter (but reasonable) one if your oil is running in the 230-266 range, and 'change as soon as possible' if you break 266. Different engine (and different recommended oil), but it's still Nissan, it's still based on the same platform, and those numbers look a lot more reasonable and normal to me than the idea that 250-280 is 'ideal' for our engines when running hard. __________________ 7AT Track Car! Journal thread / Car setup details

05-19-2009, 02:35 PM	#511 (permalink)
TheWeatherman Enthusiast Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 265 Drives: 2009 370Z 6MTw/Sport Rep Power: 16	Okay folks. Just got off the phone with someone a step up from my Midwest Regional CS Manager. First, this person races cars for fun. He races street cars. His favorite track is Road America in Wisconsin. This guy knows his stuff. He's not a kid and has been doing this a long time. 250 to 280 to him is optimal engine oil temperature for high performance driving, and he urged anyone to just look it up from reputable sources. Also, I must say, this person could not have been nicer. They're motto right now is "prove it on the street." The racetrack is a different story. This we should completely understand. This oil cooler kit is coming out for all of the people complaining for an issue that most of us have never had. (I got to the 260-280, after a 'spirited driving' session, but it never cut itself off or limited anything.) If it's not cutting off, it's running just fine. He said those of you trying to race your cars around at the much much cooler temperatures (ie. 180-200) are the ones actually not doing the engine any favors. This is some more VERY important information. You hit 300, you're in a bit of trouble, but that's where the engine will automatically limit itself. It's not the complete end of the earth nor the engine. He said if you are racing, they will have your ultimate oil cooler kit that is thermostatically controlled. That's nice. It's just about out, and wait for it. Would it have been nice to have this option earlier this year? Of course. He stressed over and over, your oil should be between 250 to 280 for its best protection of the engine in high performance driving. If you're not hitting the cut-off, the engine is by no means in danger. Should you choose to buy the Nissan Motorsports Oil Cooler kit, which I'm sure most of us are, get it done at the Nissan dealer. He said that will keep your full powertrain warranty in tact. This should start putting this to rest. I believe him completely. He was very, very nice. I want you all to read what I have posted above a couple of times. 250-280 is good for a motor being run hard. You have to be well above this range for it to break down. He also said the Nissan Ester oil is perfect in this range. He said if you're on a track and are experiencing this, your fix is coming, but otherwise if your engine doesn't go into a full limp mode, it's doing fine. He said they've pounded the piss out of these cars, and know it takes an awful lot to have the motor go into limp mode. I agree. He even urged me to take him out on our roads in "A spirited way." He races street legal race cars on tracks people, and personally had a hand in R&D. Do you know these have been out testing for almost three years before they came out? He said they flogged the hell out of them. Up mountains, in the Arizona desert, and never had these problems. He said if you are racing them, well, your oil cooler is just about out. He said just to make sure, the thermostat will keep the temps in this "hot" optimal range. Almost all of our cars are just fine and are not compromised in any way. If you race them on a track for quite a while, all out, he said they understand. Your temperature controlled coolers are coming out.

05-19-2009, 04:15 PM	#518 (permalink)
Forrest Track Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: california 707! Posts: 677 Drives: 09 370z Blk 6mt sprt Rep Power: 258	i highly agree with SoCal 370Z. Logicly none of it is making sence. Its like saying nissan figured out getting your oil to run 300degree makes for a better race car and everybody else is stupid who trys to keep there oil coiler.

05-19-2009, 05:27 PM	#519 (permalink)
mannyz Enthusiast Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 354 Drives: a car Rep Power: 279	I do understand where Nissan is coming from. They are just telling you that unless you are beating the hell out of the car, you will not get into the limb mode or shutdown, but if you do then you need to get the Oil Cooler. In othe words if you dont want your car to shutdown, drive it sloooowwwwllly! I know when I talk to the Manager at the dealer he will tell me the same thing, but I already got an answer. Why will I get a Z, or GTR, or Corvette, etc if I cannot drive it as a sport car, if this is the reasoning behind the people who make the cars, then they should stop making sport cars, and that will force me to get a Prius, or Fusion, or a Hybrid car. I still think, like everyone else, they should included the Oil Cooler, they made a Sport car, they should have more protection other than just ECU controlled. But thats my Opinion I am a computer business man, is like if you want me to build you a gaming computer, and after heating problems I tell you "yea, you can play games, but no more than 2 hours, you need to let the computer rest, shut it down, wait an hour, then play for 2 more hours" o_O

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