New Engine Noise post-Oil Cooler Install

spearfish25 · 07-15-2010, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cossie1600

I have a 25R cooler, I think I ended up using 6.2 quarts

Which way did you install it (fittings up or down)? I have my fittings down. I wonder if I have an air-lock or the dipstick isn't accurate with that orientation. I asked Modshack about the orientation question and he thought it was a non-issue. With the fittings down, would the dipstick read 'full' and then the actual circulating level be too low when the system is pressurized and flowing (ie the cooler fully fills and the oil pan level is too low)?

m4a1mustang · 07-15-2010, 12:39 PM

Assuming the oil cooler is mounted higher than the oil pan the oil will run out of the cooler when the car is off, resulting in innaccurate dipstick readings, no?

What size is your cooler? With the lines and cooler only 5.5 quarts seems really low.

spearfish25 · 07-15-2010, 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

Assuming the oil cooler is mounted higher than the oil pan the oil will run out of the cooler when the car is off, resulting in innaccurate dipstick readings, no?

What size is your cooler? With the lines and cooler only 5.5 quarts seems really low.

It's a 24 row Tru-Cool that Modshack used. It's hard to guestimate, but I wouldn't think the cooler is much taller than the oil level in the pan with the engine off. I had almost 6 quarts in there last night and I was above the H dot when pretty hot. I took off 300cc (~1/3 quart) and now it's just under the H dot when stone cold.

I just don't know any good way to check the oil level with the cooler installed to test the possibility of inaccurate dipsticks with the fittings down. I suppose I could unmount the cooler and hang it down by the ground. Then a dipstick reading should be accurate with the cooler full.

Modshack · 07-15-2010, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

Assuming the oil cooler is mounted higher than the oil pan the oil will run out of the cooler when the car is off, resulting in innaccurate dipstick readings, no?

No....The Bypass system retains oil in the cooler. Whenever I've changed oil, I always get about a quart out of the cooler and lines...

m4a1mustang · 07-15-2010, 01:18 PM

Forgot about the bypass!

spearfish25 · 07-15-2010, 01:24 PM

Modshack, you have a Starbucks gift card being emailed to you as soon as I figure out how to do it. You've been incredibly helpful with my whole install. If the bypass system retains the oil, then the dipstick will still be accurate.

So why would my PS pump make noise if I've bled the system? Just the added strain of pumping fluid through a 9-row cooler rather than a smooth tube with fins attached (the stock POS)? I'm hoping the last two sentences in the attached service manual clipping are the explanation. I followed the priming instructions in the service manual (turning lock to lock) and there aren't any more air bubbles coming out. It took about a quart to refill the PS system. What makes no sense is that the manual says the system takes 1 1/8 quarts and I've now added a new, somewhat larger cooler. Unless there is some retained fluid from the drain, I don't know why I only fit 1 quart. Annoying...

Zsteve · 07-15-2010, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spearfish25

Modshack, you have a Starbucks gift card being emailed to you as soon as I figure out how to do it. You've been incredibly helpful with my whole install. If the bypass system retains the oil, then the dipstick will still be accurate.

So why would my PS pump make noise if I've bled the system? Just the added strain of pumping fluid through a 9-row cooler rather than a smooth tube with fins attached (the stock POS)? I'm hoping the last two sentences in the attached service manual clipping are the explanation. I followed the priming instructions in the service manual (turning lock to lock) and there aren't any more air bubbles coming out. It took about a quart to refill the PS system. What makes no sense is that the manual says the system takes 1 1/8 quarts and I've now added a new, somewhat larger cooler. Unless there is some retained fluid from the drain, I don't know why I only fit 1 quart. Annoying...

he said he wanted a steak house gift card for his whole family. lol. Well Im glad to hear its not an oil cooler problem as I will be doing mine here shortlly now that Im back from my training.

spearfish25 · 07-15-2010, 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zsteve

he said he wanted a steak house gift card for his whole family. lol. Well Im glad to hear its not an oil cooler problem as I will be doing mine here shortlly now that Im back from my training.

We can't reward Modshack too much as he's defecting, and that shouldn't be encouraged with gifts.

Functionally the coolers have been working great. It's simply the issue of a new sound after installing the oil and steering coolers. The improvement in oil temps is fantastic though. 95F ambient yesterday and my temps while sitting in traffic after a sporty highway jaunt never went over 215F.

Modshack · 07-15-2010, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4a1mustang

Modshack to the rescue.

You should be on the forum payroll, you know.

LOL...send Money!

Quote:

Originally Posted by spearfish25

Modshack, you have a Starbucks gift card being emailed to you as soon as I figure out how to do it. You've been incredibly helpful with my whole install. If the bypass system retains the oil, then the dipstick will still be accurate.

So why would my PS pump make noise if I've bled the system? Just the added strain of pumping fluid through a 9-row cooler rather than a smooth tube with fins attached (the stock POS)? I'm hoping the last two sentences in the attached service manual clipping are the explanation. I followed the priming instructions in the service manual (turning lock to lock) and there aren't any more air bubbles coming out. It took about a quart to refill the PS system. What makes no sense is that the manual says the system takes 1 1/8 quarts and I've now added a new, somewhat larger cooler. Unless there is some retained fluid from the drain, I don't know why I only fit 1 quart. Annoying...

I like coffee....Contributions appreciated!

Quote:

Originally Posted by spearfish25

We can't reward Modshack too much as he's defecting, and that shouldn't be encouraged with gifts.

You guys can continue to abuse me while I'm still here.....But there are sharks circling around my car as we speak!

Modshack · 07-15-2010, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spearfish25

So why would my PS pump make noise if I've bled the system? Just the added strain of pumping fluid through a 9-row cooler rather than a smooth tube with fins attached (the stock POS)? I'm hoping the last two sentences in the attached service manual clipping are the explanation. I followed the priming instructions in the service manual (turning lock to lock) and there aren't any more air bubbles coming out. It took about a quart to refill the PS system. What makes no sense is that the manual says the system takes 1 1/8 quarts and I've now added a new, somewhat larger cooler. Unless there is some retained fluid from the drain, I don't know why I only fit 1 quart. Annoying...

Try it again...Whenever I've purged PS systems I've had both wheels off the ground and cycled things left and right several times with no load on them...

spearfish25 · 07-15-2010, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Modshack

Try it again...Whenever I've purged PS systems I've had both wheels off the ground and cycled things left and right several times with no load on them...

I can certainly do it again. However, I had the whole car on jack stands when I did it the first time. There isn't any noise when I turn the wheel lock to lock now (doesn't sound like a pissed off PS pump), and the sound is minimal when the engine is cold. As things heat up though, the throttle-related whir sound gets louder. I'm about to chalk this up to being nothing to worry about. FWIW, I'm using Redline PS fluid...anything fishy about that?

Zsteve · 07-15-2010, 02:25 PM

what is Modshack defecting to?

Modshack · 07-15-2010, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zsteve

what is Modshack defecting to?

Heh heh....I've had 58 cars. There are a few more on the Bucket List I need to check out before I can't drive anymore!

spearfish25 · 07-21-2010, 09:31 AM

Someone just posted this article. Interesting that the R&T team heard the noise as well. Rather than being engine oil related, JB1 had an interesting theory that installing the cooler just gives an avenue to transmit engine noise that was otherwise more contained...a speaker-like effect. Who knows.

Wrap Up: 2009 Nissan 370Z Touring - Article - RoadandTrack.com
Quote:
For experimental purposes, we measured interior noise both before and after a switch to conventional oil. We found there was a noticeable gain of about six decibels at middle revs in 1st gear but no real discernible difference in maximum cabin loudness. Sans sound meter, some complained about the increase of whirring sounds at low rpm over time, which are reminiscent of radio speaker feedback from an improperly grounded audio system.

sig11 · 07-21-2010, 02:20 PM

I just put my cooler on this morning and wasn't able to hear anything. Maybe the rubber buffered brackets that Setrab/Z1 put in their kits stops the vibration? Or maybe my ears are too wrecked from loud music and farm work to pick it up. :P

07-15-2010, 12:39 PM	#2 (permalink)
m4a1mustang A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Northern VA Posts: 55,385 Drives: on two wheels Rep Power: 6963	Assuming the oil cooler is mounted higher than the oil pan the oil will run out of the cooler when the car is off, resulting in innaccurate dipstick readings, no? What size is your cooler? With the lines and cooler only 5.5 quarts seems really low. __________________ - Steve Zs & Coffee - Saturdays at 10AM in Fairfax, VA and Columbia, MD (Click the banner!) LIKE us on Facebook!

07-15-2010, 01:18 PM	#5 (permalink)
m4a1mustang A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Northern VA Posts: 55,385 Drives: on two wheels Rep Power: 6963	Forgot about the bypass! __________________ - Steve Zs & Coffee - Saturdays at 10AM in Fairfax, VA and Columbia, MD (Click the banner!) LIKE us on Facebook!

07-15-2010, 02:25 PM	#12 (permalink)
Zsteve A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: TX Posts: 3,298 Drives: the 2 balled club Rep Power: 22	what is Modshack defecting to? __________________ 2010 LS3 C6 Silver coupe corvette

07-21-2010, 09:31 AM	#14 (permalink)
spearfish25 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Naples, FL Posts: 4,117 Drives: to work Rep Power: 1857	Someone just posted this article. Interesting that the R&T team heard the noise as well. Rather than being engine oil related, JB1 had an interesting theory that installing the cooler just gives an avenue to transmit engine noise that was otherwise more contained...a speaker-like effect. Who knows. Wrap Up: 2009 Nissan 370Z Touring - Article - RoadandTrack.com Quote: For experimental purposes, we measured interior noise both before and after a switch to conventional oil. We found there was a noticeable gain of about six decibels at middle revs in 1st gear but no real discernible difference in maximum cabin loudness. Sans sound meter, some complained about the increase of whirring sounds at low rpm over time, which are reminiscent of radio speaker feedback from an improperly grounded audio system. __________________ 2013 Cadillac V-Wagon, RIP Z

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07-21-2010, 02:20 PM	#15 (permalink)
sig11 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Detroit Posts: 1,294 Drives: 09 370Z Red Sport-MT Rep Power: 18	I just put my cooler on this morning and wasn't able to hear anything. Maybe the rubber buffered brackets that Setrab/Z1 put in their kits stops the vibration? Or maybe my ears are too wrecked from loud music and farm work to pick it up. :P