Gas Pedal Delay

IcedZ · 12-21-2010, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike's 370z

I have followed this thread for a while now, and the more I read I think it is a purposed design. I think that maybe in the same vein that Nissan wanted better MPG and henceforth did not include front brake ducts that would have decreased mileage due to drag, perhaps Nissan mapped the throttle in such a manner that if not fully depressed at launched at a high RPM, the car sips fuel below 3000 RPM. Further that with the torque curves seen in just about every dyno map done on a stock 370z, with a huge dip between 2500 and 3000 RPM, and the hesitation makes perfect sense - not that it does not suck.
It is ironic that a simple fix such as the gadget that increases voltage to the gas peddle is all that is needed to overcome some of the hesitation, but the inherent design of the engine and mappings make it fairly difficult (or at least some serious investments) to overcome.

Car and Driver Investigates Brake issue
Z Meets Wall: We Investigate Why the NISMO Z's Brakes Failed at Lightning Lap - Feature - Auto Reviews - Car and Driver

Agreed, there is an inherent lack of response... but again, there is a change in the car. It gets REALLY bad after some period of driving. I find that in-city driving make it much worse. I lose SO MUCH power that I feel like I will stall if I release below 1500RPM. But not all the time.

IcedZ · 12-21-2010, 03:01 PM

On another note, I finally got a chance to take my car to the track. It was EMBARRASSING. On the couple of runs that the car would cooperate, I made good times. But most of the time it was awful. I am seriously considering a new car (mustang?) now.
It was a beautiful day, barely hit 70. Could do 10 laps at MOST before hitting true limp mode (oil >260), and maybe 4 laps before semi-limp where speed is limited to 65(?)mph. The track is just shy of 1 mile. A couple times when oil was only ~235, the car REFUSED to respond. Just went completely dead. It was pitiful. I am very disappointed.

spitfire9200 · 12-21-2010, 03:21 PM

I get this too... in for an update? It feels like if i'm below 1500-2000 RPMs and I floor it the car tries to go forward, halts itself, then finally winds up. It's one of the reasons I want to get rid of the thing. It's unacceptable and annoying. My 350z didn't do that at all, I could launch it no problem.

ChrisSlicks · 12-21-2010, 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IcedZ

On another note, I finally got a chance to take my car to the track. It was EMBARRASSING. On the couple of runs that the car would cooperate, I made good times. But most of the time it was awful. I am seriously considering a new car (mustang?) now.
It was a beautiful day, barely hit 70. Could do 10 laps at MOST before hitting true limp mode (oil >260), and maybe 4 laps before semi-limp where speed is limited to 65(?)mph. The track is just shy of 1 mile. A couple times when oil was only ~235, the car REFUSED to respond. Just went completely dead. It was pitiful. I am very disappointed.

The car can not be tracked successfully without an oil cooler even with cooler ambient temps. The water temp is always going to be around 190-210F and the water cooling the block is the only thing that indirectly cools the oil on these cars. Did you have traction control on? VDC kills all power if you try to accelerate coming off a corner.

xdeslitx · 12-21-2010, 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spitfire9200

I get this too... in for an update? It feels like if i'm below 1500-2000 RPMs and I floor it the car tries to go forward, halts itself, then finally winds up. It's one of the reasons I want to get rid of the thing. It's unacceptable and annoying. My 350z didn't do that at all, I could launch it no problem.

Your problem sounds like a normal drive by wire issue...you have to gradually depress the gas pedal when you're that low in the rpm's. You're gonna experience the lag when you floor it.

Dreezy562 · 12-21-2010, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xdeslitx

Your problem sounds like a normal drive by wire issue...you have to gradually depress the gas pedal when you're that low in the rpm's. You're gonna experience the lag when you floor it.

IcedZ · 12-21-2010, 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dreezy562

NO, and NO.
Jeeze. If you aren't experiencing it, you don't know what we are referring to. YES, agreed... it's sluggish in that area of the power band. But it gets WORSE sometimes. It's tolerable normally. But sometimes it just acts up and it absolutely horrendous.

IcedZ · 12-21-2010, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisSlicks

The car can not be tracked successfully without an oil cooler even with cooler ambient temps. The water temp is always going to be around 190-210F and the water cooling the block is the only thing that indirectly cools the oil on these cars. Did you have traction control on? VDC kills all power if you try to accelerate coming off a corner.

VDC was on first couple laps, then off. Didn't make a whole lot of difference.

spitfire9200 · 12-21-2010, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IcedZ

NO, and NO.
Jeeze. If you aren't experiencing it, you don't know what we are referring to. YES, agreed... it's sluggish in that area of the power band. But it gets WORSE sometimes. It's tolerable normally. But sometimes it just acts up and it absolutely horrendous.

yea... I understand that it would obviously take a small moment for the car to rev up from those low RPMs, but it seriously just stops, then goes. It feels as if the car is slipping on VDC or the clutch wasn't grabbing properly.

Like I said, my 350z didn't do that, my RSX didn't do that, none of my cars do that.

You can almost feel the ECU saying "HOLD ON THERE CHAMP" and cutting power, then suddenly letting up and allowing the car to rev up normally again.

xdeslitx · 12-21-2010, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IcedZ

NO, and NO.
Jeeze. If you aren't experiencing it, you don't know what we are referring to. YES, agreed... it's sluggish in that area of the power band. But it gets WORSE sometimes. It's tolerable normally. But sometimes it just acts up and it absolutely horrendous.

Dude relax. I wasn't even referring to you. Maybe the guy wasn't explaining it clearly from my point of view. All I said was the way he described it sounded like it was DBW.
And FYI before you blow up, I have experienced the problem you are having only once(luckily)
I was driving up a hill and the car wouldn't give me any power, I didn't think I was going to make it up the hill.
So just take a frickin chill pill because we are all just trying to help each other here.
I wasn't even bashing the guy and calling him a dumba$$ or anything.

DIGItonium · 12-21-2010, 05:19 PM

If this is a DBW issue, then it would be consistent from the start. The car is very responsive from the start after warming up the car. I can get the car rolling and floor it, and the car immediately revs up and overwhelms the tires.

After awhile, regardless of oil temps (even around 160-190 range), the car starts losing power below 3k band. Granted, torque is not as plentiful, but it feels artificially limited.

Anyhow, you don't need to floor it to feel the lack of power. You can give it 30-70% throttle while rolling in 1st or 2nd. The car initially revs up, but stalls around 2.5k before climbing past 3k and continuing regardless of throttle input. It feels like VDC cutting power. Now, while the car is "cutting power," I can literally go from 30% to 100% throttle in 1st and 2nd and it feels like I'm in the wrong gear.

Under this circumstance, and under casual acceleration, other cars are able to out accelerate me as the engine feels like it is struggling under 3k RPM even at 100% throttle and holding it down. Even with VDC off, the tires won't slip anymore from a roll.

I turn the car off and let it wait a few minutes, and the normal response comes back and I can start lighting up tires from a roll in 1st.

This is what I go through driving to and from work... not racing.

6spd · 12-21-2010, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DIGItonium

Anyhow, you don't need to floor it to feel the lack of power. You can give it 30-70% throttle while rolling in 1st or 2nd. The car initially revs up, but stalls around 2.5k before climbing past 3k and continuing regardless of throttle input. It feels like VDC cutting power.

this pretty much sums up the experience of driving this car. this is constant for me and ive always chocked it up to DBW, because just about every DBW car i drive does the same thing, my moms TSX, my fiancees civic si, any of the newer cars i test drive at work... pretty much all of them. it makes it feel like a jerky take off. as far as the trouble as oil temps rise and loosing response, sure it happens to me, but not anything like some of these guys are describing.

so far we have decently conclusive evidence the following dont fix the problem being described:
1. oil coolers
2. reflashes/tunes
3. different engine oils
4. dealers
5. dealers
6. oh yeah... dealers

some have suggested the sprint booster thingy and swear by it... idk.

IcedZ · 12-21-2010, 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DIGItonium

If this is a DBW issue, then it would be consistent from the start. The car is very responsive from the start after warming up the car. I can get the car rolling and floor it, and the car immediately revs up and overwhelms the tires.

After awhile, regardless of oil temps (even around 160-190 range), the car starts losing power below 3k band. Granted, torque is not as plentiful, but it feels artificially limited.

Anyhow, you don't need to floor it to feel the lack of power. You can give it 30-70% throttle while rolling in 1st or 2nd. The car initially revs up, but stalls around 2.5k before climbing past 3k and continuing regardless of throttle input. It feels like VDC cutting power. Now, while the car is "cutting power," I can literally go from 30% to 100% throttle in 1st and 2nd and it feels like I'm in the wrong gear.

Under this circumstance, and under casual acceleration, other cars are able to out accelerate me as the engine feels like it is struggling under 3k RPM even at 100% throttle and holding it down. Even with VDC off, the tires won't slip anymore from a roll.

I turn the car off and let it wait a few minutes, and the normal response comes back and I can start lighting up tires from a roll in 1st.

This is what I go through driving to and from work... not racing.

THIS. Exactly. Feels like I'm a gear or 2 too high. And same here, day to day driving.

IcedZ · 12-21-2010, 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xdeslitx

Dude relax. I wasn't even referring to you. Maybe the guy wasn't explaining it clearly from my point of view. All I said was the way he described it sounded like it was DBW.
And FYI before you blow up, I have experienced the problem you are having only once(luckily)
I was driving up a hill and the car wouldn't give me any power, I didn't think I was going to make it up the hill.
So just take a frickin chill pill because we are all just trying to help each other here.
I wasn't even bashing the guy and calling him a dumba$$ or anything.

Sorry, just very very frustrating. Dealer is no help. Nissan Consumer affairs is minimally helpful.

xdeslitx · 12-21-2010, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IcedZ

Sorry, just very very frustrating. Dealer is no help. Nissan Consumer affairs is minimally helpful.

Didn't mean to sound like an a$$ in my last post, I just hit reply before I read it over.

12-21-2010, 05:19 PM	#431 (permalink)
DIGItonium A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Kansas Posts: 3,800 Drives: 09 Z34-TT 6MT Rep Power: 42	If this is a DBW issue, then it would be consistent from the start. The car is very responsive from the start after warming up the car. I can get the car rolling and floor it, and the car immediately revs up and overwhelms the tires. After awhile, regardless of oil temps (even around 160-190 range), the car starts losing power below 3k band. Granted, torque is not as plentiful, but it feels artificially limited. Anyhow, you don't need to floor it to feel the lack of power. You can give it 30-70% throttle while rolling in 1st or 2nd. The car initially revs up, but stalls around 2.5k before climbing past 3k and continuing regardless of throttle input. It feels like VDC cutting power. Now, while the car is "cutting power," I can literally go from 30% to 100% throttle in 1st and 2nd and it feels like I'm in the wrong gear. Under this circumstance, and under casual acceleration, other cars are able to out accelerate me as the engine feels like it is struggling under 3k RPM even at 100% throttle and holding it down. Even with VDC off, the tires won't slip anymore from a roll. I turn the car off and let it wait a few minutes, and the normal response comes back and I can start lighting up tires from a roll in 1st. This is what I go through driving to and from work... not racing. __________________

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12-21-2010, 03:01 PM	#422 (permalink)
IcedZ Base Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Gainesville, FL Posts: 194 Drives: 09 370 Yellow, 6MT Rep Power: 16	On another note, I finally got a chance to take my car to the track. It was EMBARRASSING. On the couple of runs that the car would cooperate, I made good times. But most of the time it was awful. I am seriously considering a new car (mustang?) now. It was a beautiful day, barely hit 70. Could do 10 laps at MOST before hitting true limp mode (oil >260), and maybe 4 laps before semi-limp where speed is limited to 65(?)mph. The track is just shy of 1 mile. A couple times when oil was only ~235, the car REFUSED to respond. Just went completely dead. It was pitiful. I am very disappointed.

12-21-2010, 03:21 PM	#423 (permalink)
spitfire9200 Enthusiast Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Reston, VA Posts: 390 Drives: 13' E92 M3 Rep Power: 16	I get this too... in for an update? It feels like if i'm below 1500-2000 RPMs and I floor it the car tries to go forward, halts itself, then finally winds up. It's one of the reasons I want to get rid of the thing. It's unacceptable and annoying. My 350z didn't do that at all, I could launch it no problem.