Gas Pedal Delay

christian370z · 09-03-2010, 07:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisSlicks

You can do the same exact thing inside the ECU, so I say don't waste money on this just buy an UpRev license and do much more.

Ah, so a good tuner can adjust for throttle delay within UpRev (I would assume SpecialtyZ or Technosquare can do this). To what degree can you adjust those parameters on the ECU?

ChrisSlicks · 09-03-2010, 10:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by christian370z

Ah, so a good tuner can adjust for throttle delay within UpRev (I would assume SpecialtyZ or Technosquare can do this). To what degree can you adjust those parameters on the ECU?

There is no delay per se. There is the throttle position to actual map (you can see these values reading the live scan data via OBDII). The other parts of the puzzle that slow response are the electronic intake control and the VVEL itself. Tuners can address the first 2 currently but none have made available the latter. Bandaid parts like the SprintBooster attempt to address the first issue only by giving you a lead foot. In the process it destroys linearity so trying to feather the throttle through a corner becomes more difficult.

christian370z · 09-03-2010, 11:16 PM

That helps me understand the background, I would send you some rep. but it won't let me lol. This VVEL uncrackability is holding back more than just the power potential of this car then, I knew about the intake control opening up top which must be why response is so much quicker in the upper rev range too.

6spd · 09-03-2010, 11:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisSlicks

There is no delay per se. There is the throttle position to actual map (you can see these values reading the live scan data via OBDII). The other parts of the puzzle that slow response are the electronic intake control and the VVEL itself. Tuners can address the first 2 currently but none have made available the latter. Bandaid parts like the SprintBooster attempt to address the first issue only by giving you a lead foot. In the process it destroys linearity so trying to feather the throttle through a corner becomes more difficult.

yes, everything you said is correct. my first instinct was "this is simple tom-foolery, it is just changing the voltage per percent of pedal travel". So in theory the same effect can be had by simply pressing the gas pedal farther and faster. This may be simplifying it a bit, but it is in a sense what is occurring. I'd still rather have a reliable tune than a questionable (reliability-wise) trick.

DIGItonium · 09-04-2010, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 6spd

So in theory the same effect can be had by simply pressing the gas pedal farther and faster.

This is the problem I have. I can literally floor it in 2nd, and it feels like accelerating in 6th. There's no wheelspin, and or back against the seat feeling. The engine doesn't scream either. When making a left turn and giving it roughly 30-40% steady throttle in 1st, the car hesitated around 2k in the middle of the turn instead of linearly accelerating regardless of VDC mode. What's more confusing is that this problem comes and goes.

Last night when I merged I did the same for 3rd and 4th. I didn't quite floor it, but the car jerked back and accelerated hard pushing me into the seat.

I don't think the SprintBooster will help because I can literally floor it on a roll, and the car can hesitate at random times regardless of VDC. However, on first start and initial minutes of driving it pulls hard. After an extended period (15+ minutes) of driving is when the described problems creep up.

KillerBee370 · 09-04-2010, 08:15 PM

So I go in to my tuner and tried to explain the problem to him. He hooks up the computer to my car (which already had ECU tune) and does something. He then proceeds to look at me and smile and say "Ok.. I'm not going to tell you what I did but let me know if you notice anything".

Definitely no more laggy throttle problems. IDK what he did but it seems to be fixed. I will have to report back to him and get an answer for you guys. (Not that it will help unless you have the same tune however it might lend some insight)

Nismo221 · 09-04-2010, 09:13 PM

I just read a post today about a spirtbooster. From what I saw it increases throttle response. website was like spirtboostersales.com i think it was like $350. may want to look into it, im going to.....

G Fo12ce · 09-05-2010, 02:34 AM

I read over most of this the other day. Today I was going through the Oct. Option magazine and came accross an alternative to the Sprint Booster from Blitz called the Blitz Throttle Controller. I made a post about it HERE if you care to discuss.

fxroar · 09-05-2010, 11:49 AM

This was a major problem for my red 370z before I traded it for the 40th. I understand that this car does not have a lot kick at lower rpm but like some, I get to a point where I almost get tboned turning left on a yield intersection for having that slow throttle response. After 10k miles and pulling the trigger on the 25 row oil cooler AND finally switching to redline 5w30 motor oil.. For some reason eliminated that problem on my case. Having the oil temp between 180F - 215F definitely kept the car lively and responsive at ALL gears except 6th. Even after driving for hours.. The "kick" in the lower rpm - just like the first time you start the car - is definitely there. I don't know.. I'm not saying the oil temp and the oil switch to redline is the fix for for everyone but it definitely did for mine.

Now that I didn't keep the oil cooler I'm sure it will be the FIRST mod for my 40th.

-Francis

WarmAndSCSI · 09-05-2010, 11:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fxroar

This was a major problem for my red 370z before I traded it for the 40th. I understand that this car does not have a lot kick at lower rpm but like some, I get to a point where I almost get tboned turning left on a yield intersection for having that slow throttle response. After 10k miles and pulling the trigger on the 25 row oil cooler AND finally switching to redline 5w30 motor oil.. For some reason eliminated that problem on my case. Having the oil temp between 180F - 215F definitely kept the car lively and responsive at ALL gears except 6th. Even after driving for hours.. The "kick" in the lower rpm - just like the first time you start the car - is definitely there. I don't know.. I'm not saying the oil temp and the oil switch to redline is the fix for for everyone but it definitely did for mine.

Now that I didn't keep the oil cooler I'm sure it will be the FIRST mod for my 40th.

-Francis

I'm quite a fan of Red Line in race engine applications, and I will tell you straight up that switching oil had nothing to do with that change in behavior, perceived or actual.

6spd · 09-05-2010, 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KillerBee370

So I go in to my tuner and tried to explain the problem to him. He hooks up the computer to my car (which already had ECU tune) and does something. He then proceeds to look at me and smile and say "Ok.. I'm not going to tell you what I did but let me know if you notice anything".

Definitely no more laggy throttle problems. IDK what he did but it seems to be fixed. I will have to report back to him and get an answer for you guys. (Not that it will help unless you have the same tune however it might lend some insight)

thats bs. he should tell you what he did. you should demand to know what he did, after all it is your car.

KillerBee370 · 09-05-2010, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 6spd

thats bs. he should tell you what he did. you should demand to know what he did, after all it is your car.

It's not like that. If it was a one time deal of course I would find out. He put over 700 dyno miles on my car so we have a bit of history. He likes to joke around from time to time. Also, he's going to tell me but he wants to get the feedback as well in a "double blind" sort of way.

6spd · 09-05-2010, 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KillerBee370

It's not like that. If it was a one time deal of course I would find out. He put over 700 dyno miles on my car so we have a bit of history. He likes to joke around from time to time. Also, he's going to tell me but he wants to get the feedback as well in a "double blind" sort of way.

ok that makes sense. i'd love to hear what he did!

fxroar · 09-05-2010, 10:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WarmAndSCSI

I'm quite a fan of Red Line in race engine applications, and I will tell you straight up that switching oil had nothing to do with that change in behavior, perceived or actual.

Im pretty sure its not either.. But what I was trying to get to is that having lower temp with the help of the oil cooler and the full syn blend cured that dilemma on the red Z by keeping the engine at Fah around optimal performance.

TROOPER · 09-05-2010, 10:24 PM

So it looks like a tuner is needed to fix this problem..??

I've had this happen twice since I added CBE & HFC, but I assumed it was VDC or maybe the ECU relearning after the mods.

If it needs a tune, what's the alternative to the Cobb AccessPort since they stopped making it.

09-03-2010, 11:16 PM	#183 (permalink)
christian370z A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Newport Beach Posts: 3,900 Drives: 2010 370Z/Saab 900se Rep Power: 432	That helps me understand the background, I would send you some rep. but it won't let me lol. This VVEL uncrackability is holding back more than just the power potential of this car then, I knew about the intake control opening up top which must be why response is so much quicker in the upper rev range too. __________________ -320whp / 259wftlbs- SP Rays -- RE-11s -- SpecialtyZ Tune -- Swift Springs -- Stillen 25R Oil Cooler -- Stillen G3 Intakes -- Berk HFCs -- F.I. 12" CBE -- Stillen Sway Bars -- Es14 Spring -- INGS+1 lip -- CF Spoiler -- GTR Start Button -- VLED Parking Lights -- PWJDM V2 shift knob

09-05-2010, 02:34 AM	#188 (permalink)
G Fo12ce Premium Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Socal Posts: 996 Drives: Sold! Rep Power: 52	I read over most of this the other day. Today I was going through the Oct. Option magazine and came accross an alternative to the Sprint Booster from Blitz called the Blitz Throttle Controller. I made a post about it HERE if you care to discuss. __________________ Nismo Suspension: New Owners Check Here!

09-05-2010, 11:49 AM	#189 (permalink)
fxroar Track Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 525 Drives: '10 40th Anniversary Rep Power: 17	This was a major problem for my red 370z before I traded it for the 40th. I understand that this car does not have a lot kick at lower rpm but like some, I get to a point where I almost get tboned turning left on a yield intersection for having that slow throttle response. After 10k miles and pulling the trigger on the 25 row oil cooler AND finally switching to redline 5w30 motor oil.. For some reason eliminated that problem on my case. Having the oil temp between 180F - 215F definitely kept the car lively and responsive at ALL gears except 6th. Even after driving for hours.. The "kick" in the lower rpm - just like the first time you start the car - is definitely there. I don't know.. I'm not saying the oil temp and the oil switch to redline is the fix for for everyone but it definitely did for mine. Now that I didn't keep the oil cooler I'm sure it will be the FIRST mod for my 40th. -Francis __________________ Fast Intentions / K&N / Blox / Evo-R / Uprev / Forgestar 19" F14 / R40 / NST / Z1 / SDCE / H&R / Kenwood / ISS Forged 20" FM10R

09-05-2010, 10:24 PM	#195 (permalink)
TROOPER A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 1,297 Drives: Your Tax Dollars Rep Power: 17	So it looks like a tuner is needed to fix this problem..?? I've had this happen twice since I added CBE & HFC, but I assumed it was VDC or maybe the ECU relearning after the mods. If it needs a tune, what's the alternative to the Cobb AccessPort since they stopped making it. __________________ Darren "Guv Motors Passion Wagon"

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09-04-2010, 08:15 PM	#186 (permalink)
KillerBee370 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: So Cal baby! Age: 51 Posts: 5,964 Drives: with passion Rep Power: 321	So I go in to my tuner and tried to explain the problem to him. He hooks up the computer to my car (which already had ECU tune) and does something. He then proceeds to look at me and smile and say "Ok.. I'm not going to tell you what I did but let me know if you notice anything". Definitely no more laggy throttle problems. IDK what he did but it seems to be fixed. I will have to report back to him and get an answer for you guys. (Not that it will help unless you have the same tune however it might lend some insight)

09-04-2010, 09:13 PM	#187 (permalink)
Nismo221 Enthusiast Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Decatur, Alabama Age: 36 Posts: 489 Drives: 2010 370z Nismo Rep Power: 15	I just read a post today about a spirtbooster. From what I saw it increases throttle response. website was like spirtboostersales.com i think it was like $350. may want to look into it, im going to.....