Cold Air Intake Usefull ?

ZeeYouLater · 03-05-2010, 01:01 PM

Hello everyone, my question :
Is a cold air intake system usefull ?

1. It has a longer intake tube ! = more air resistance means less throttle response
2. how many degrees are possible for combustion benefit on high flow ? (dynamometer is not street ..hood open ..active e-power cooling with tuner selling arguments)
3. Higher possibility of water blow at havey rain with slopes (the orig-box uses gravity/capacity to get rid of)
4. Only sound reasons... opening the VVEL

5. The plus margins i reviewed are not amazing for the price

excuse my bad english

Chriz · 03-05-2010, 01:02 PM

Yes

Caravanshaka · 03-05-2010, 01:35 PM

the major brands are pushing around 10-15 whp for $500ish...that is a pretty nice power pickup for the price.

ZeeYouLater · 03-05-2010, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caravanshaka

the major brands are pushing around 10-15 whp for $500ish...that is a pretty nice power pickup for the price.

330 x 12
=== = x = about 3.6% more
100

this is less then the measurement tolerance of the dynamometer 8-10% that is always a argument why the measurements differ

and this is not becaues of the weather forecast

1slow370 · 03-05-2010, 03:24 PM

there are people on here that have done back to back dynos to show they make power when tested in the exact same conditions (most of the time with an even hotter engine) on the same dyno. from one dyno to another there is a large percentage of error but back to back pulls are fairly accurateand the car only makes 280~ whp not 330 so 12 hp is more like 4.2 percent and an easier equation is 12/285 = .042 or 4.2 percent. Most CAI systems even with the longer tube are less restrictive thanks to the elimination of the accordian sections, restrictivly small filters and air passages, and cldier air thank to a more remote intake location.

theDreamer · 03-05-2010, 03:30 PM

Price per power for the Z:
~High flow cats
~Intake
~Exhaust

HFC & Intake are about the same price and have proven gains by forum members here which are similar in results. I think HFC can get you about 2-4 more HP overall, but Stillen Gen III putting down 15-18 with proven results is hard to pass up. The stock box is technically a cold air system but by itself is restrictive more than aftermarket systems. Like 1slow370 said, the accordian lines, the filters, even grabbing the behind the radiator is not helping.
Now you can easily just throw on silicon tubes, new filters and a bit of Modshack changes and probably get the same results as many other CAI systems.

To answer your questions more specifically:
1. It has a longer intake tube ! = more air resistance means less throttle response
~Not true, the better piping will help keep things running at the same level.
2. how many degrees are possible for combustion benefit on high flow ? (dynamometer is not street ..hood open ..active e-power cooling with tuner selling arguments)
~Not exactly sure on this one, but from member testing here people do not do hood open or "selling pitch." Members want real world numbers with tough challenges, heck in Texas we get 100° or higher so a major problem with stock box and other options are heat soak engines which are a major factor in power loss. The Stillen Gen III and Injen are always pulling the coldest air you can get for this car.
3. Higher possibility of water blow at havey rain with slopes (the orig-box uses gravity/capacity to get rid of)
~Nope, the Stillen Gen II are to high for water to get close and the Injen are inside an enclosed area similar to the stock boxes.
4. Only sound reasons... opening the VVEL

~Nope, power gains and sound
5. The plus margins i reviewed are not amazing for the price
~Price per HP is above average for this car. Now compared to other cars which can get cheaper parts for higher HP maybe.

m4a1mustang · 03-05-2010, 03:30 PM

Search is you friend.

Stillen G3s and Injen LTs are worth it... the rest are not.

Zsteve · 03-05-2010, 03:32 PM

The stock intake does very good and is a CAI, if you were to put in better flowing filters do the vent DIY mod and put in silicon tubes were the ribbed ones are you have the same thing for about 1/2 the price. Modshacks vent DIY yeilds the same intake temps as the long tube intakes with the stock airbox so all that is needed is better flowing filters and if you want the silicon maf tubes. No silicon tubes and you are looking at a 1/3 of the cost of long tubes.

m4a1mustang · 03-05-2010, 03:32 PM

Again, your avatar is awesome.

Zsteve · 03-05-2010, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theDreamer

Price per power for the Z:
~High flow cats
~Intake
~Exhaust

HFC & Intake are about the same price and have proven gains by forum members here which are similar in results. I think HFC can get you about 2-4 more HP overall, but Stillen Gen III putting down 15-18 with proven results is hard to pass up. The stock box is technically a cold air system but by itself is restrictive more than aftermarket systems. Like 1slow370 said, the accordian lines, the filters, even grabbing the behind the radiator is not helping.
Now you can easily just throw on silicon tubes, new filters and a bit of Modshack changes and probably get the same results as many other CAI systems.

To answer your questions more specifically:
1. It has a longer intake tube ! = more air resistance means less throttle response
~Not true, the better piping will help keep things running at the same level.
2. how many degrees are possible for combustion benefit on high flow ? (dynamometer is not street ..hood open ..active e-power cooling with tuner selling arguments)
~Not exactly sure on this one
3. Higher possibility of water blow at havey rain with slopes (the orig-box uses gravity/capacity to get rid of)
~Nope, the Stillen Gen II are to high for water to get close and the Injen are inside an enclosed area similar to the stock boxes.
4. Only sound reasons... opening the VVEL

~Nope, power gains and sound
5. The plus margins i reviewed are not amazing for the price
~Price per HP is above average for this car. Now compared to other cars which can get cheaper parts for higher HP maybe.

Hey you posted my stuff before me. The DIY stuff is a good money saver.

theDreamer · 03-05-2010, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zsteve

Hey you posted my stuff before me. The DIY stuff is a good money saver.

Yeah, my post is getting longer.
The DIY is great and probably worth it for many members who like to do that, but for some the "reliability" coming from a name brand is what sells it. Though new tubs, filters & modshack vents and you are just as good.

6MT · 03-05-2010, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZeeYouLater

Hello everyone, my question :
Is a cold air intake system usefull ?

1. It has a longer intake tube ! = more air resistance means less throttle response
2. how many degrees are possible for combustion benefit on high flow ? (dynamometer is not street ..hood open ..active e-power cooling with tuner selling arguments)
3. Higher possibility of water blow at havey rain with slopes (the orig-box uses gravity/capacity to get rid of)
4. Only sound reasons... opening the VVEL

5. The plus margins i reviewed are not amazing for the price

excuse my bad english

1. No... the CAI's don't use the "acordian" hoses (tubes). Less restriction... better air flow.
2. The long intakes are better because they draw air from further away from the heat of the engine... thus cooler.
3. Possible, but if you think about the route the water would have to travel (for the long tube kits, that is)...highly unlikely. But, if you like driving "almost" under water.... Injen makes a by-pass unit.
4. YES!! If there's one thing a CAI does on this car... it's letting the engine "speak" louder. (Sounds soooo sweet!!)
5. HP gains are minimal. If you get more than 10whp... I think that's "bovine scatology" your push'n!

Caravanshaka · 03-05-2010, 03:42 PM

but, to do modshacks mod correctly, you need to resize the MAF tubes to "trick" the sensor into thinking less air is coming into the engine than really is, therefore leaning out your air/fuel ratio to produce a little more power.

Keeping stock MAF tubes and smoothing the rest will yield a little more efficiency, but won't cause any change in the A/F ratio.

Zsteve · 03-05-2010, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theDreamer

Yeah, my post is getting longer.
The DIY is great and probably worth it for many members who like to do that, but for some the "reliability" coming from a name brand is what sells it. Though new tubs, filters & modshack vents and you are just as good.

Im in the process of ordering the vent and cooler stuff to get ready for the TX heat.

Zsteve · 03-05-2010, 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caravanshaka

but, to do modshacks mod correctly, you need to resize the MAF tubes to "trick" the sensor into thinking less air is coming into the engine than really is, therefore leaning out your air/fuel ratio to produce a little more power.

Keeping stock MAF tubes and smoothing the rest will yield a little more efficiency, but won't cause any change in the A/F ratio.

No thats a whole different story there, has nothing to do with the vents getting colder air to the intake box. Unless the long tubes have a bigger MAF tube, Im not sure about that.

03-05-2010, 01:01 PM	#1 (permalink)
ZeeYouLater Base Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Swiss Posts: 39 Drives: 370z Roadster Rep Power: 15	Cold Air Intake Usefull ? Hello everyone, my question : Is a cold air intake system usefull ? 1. It has a longer intake tube ! = more air resistance means less throttle response 2. how many degrees are possible for combustion benefit on high flow ? (dynamometer is not street ..hood open ..active e-power cooling with tuner selling arguments) 3. Higher possibility of water blow at havey rain with slopes (the orig-box uses gravity/capacity to get rid of) 4. Only sound reasons... opening the VVEL 5. The plus margins i reviewed are not amazing for the price excuse my bad english Last edited by ZeeYouLater; 03-05-2010 at 01:14 PM.

03-05-2010, 01:02 PM	#2 (permalink)
Chriz Track Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Houston TX Posts: 626 Drives: '10 370z PW 7AT Rep Power: 16	Yes __________________ PW 7AT w/Sports Pkg Hook Em!

03-05-2010, 01:35 PM	#3 (permalink)
Caravanshaka I shake Caravans Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: north Dallas Posts: 9,517 Drives: everyone crazy Rep Power: 42	the major brands are pushing around 10-15 whp for $500ish...that is a pretty nice power pickup for the price. __________________ ____________________ PROJECT DiaD - Sold but not forgotten! The first testicular guard, the "Cup," was used in Hockey in 1874 and the first helmet was used in 1974. That means it only took 100 years for men to realize that in order to work the penis, the brain must remain whole.

03-05-2010, 03:24 PM	#5 (permalink)
1slow370 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: In the D Posts: 3,732 Drives: v8 74 260z ;) Rep Power: 7251	there are people on here that have done back to back dynos to show they make power when tested in the exact same conditions (most of the time with an even hotter engine) on the same dyno. from one dyno to another there is a large percentage of error but back to back pulls are fairly accurateand the car only makes 280~ whp not 330 so 12 hp is more like 4.2 percent and an easier equation is 12/285 = .042 or 4.2 percent. Most CAI systems even with the longer tube are less restrictive thanks to the elimination of the accordian sections, restrictivly small filters and air passages, and cldier air thank to a more remote intake location. __________________ ANSWER PRICE LIST Answers - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - $0.75 Answers (requiring thought) - - - - $1.25 Answers (correct) - - - - - - - - - - $12.50

03-05-2010, 03:30 PM	#6 (permalink)
theDreamer A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 30,879 Drives: 370z Rep Power: 4210	Price per power for the Z: ~High flow cats ~Intake ~Exhaust HFC & Intake are about the same price and have proven gains by forum members here which are similar in results. I think HFC can get you about 2-4 more HP overall, but Stillen Gen III putting down 15-18 with proven results is hard to pass up. The stock box is technically a cold air system but by itself is restrictive more than aftermarket systems. Like 1slow370 said, the accordian lines, the filters, even grabbing the behind the radiator is not helping. Now you can easily just throw on silicon tubes, new filters and a bit of Modshack changes and probably get the same results as many other CAI systems. To answer your questions more specifically: 1. It has a longer intake tube ! = more air resistance means less throttle response ~Not true, the better piping will help keep things running at the same level. 2. how many degrees are possible for combustion benefit on high flow ? (dynamometer is not street ..hood open ..active e-power cooling with tuner selling arguments) ~Not exactly sure on this one, but from member testing here people do not do hood open or "selling pitch." Members want real world numbers with tough challenges, heck in Texas we get 100° or higher so a major problem with stock box and other options are heat soak engines which are a major factor in power loss. The Stillen Gen III and Injen are always pulling the coldest air you can get for this car. 3. Higher possibility of water blow at havey rain with slopes (the orig-box uses gravity/capacity to get rid of) ~Nope, the Stillen Gen II are to high for water to get close and the Injen are inside an enclosed area similar to the stock boxes. 4. Only sound reasons... opening the VVEL ~Nope, power gains and sound 5. The plus margins i reviewed are not amazing for the price ~Price per HP is above average for this car. Now compared to other cars which can get cheaper parts for higher HP maybe. __________________ theDreamer's Z // Fast Intentions // Uprev // GTM // HKS // TEIN theDreamer's Silvia // URAS // GREDDY Houston Zs // Facebook // Twitter // Instagram Last edited by theDreamer; 03-05-2010 at 03:34 PM.

03-05-2010, 03:30 PM	#7 (permalink)
m4a1mustang A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Northern VA Posts: 55,385 Drives: on two wheels Rep Power: 6962	Search is you friend. Stillen G3s and Injen LTs are worth it... the rest are not. __________________ - Steve Zs & Coffee - Saturdays at 10AM in Fairfax, VA and Columbia, MD (Click the banner!) LIKE us on Facebook!

03-05-2010, 03:32 PM	#8 (permalink)
Zsteve A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: TX Posts: 3,298 Drives: the 2 balled club Rep Power: 22	The stock intake does very good and is a CAI, if you were to put in better flowing filters do the vent DIY mod and put in silicon tubes were the ribbed ones are you have the same thing for about 1/2 the price. Modshacks vent DIY yeilds the same intake temps as the long tube intakes with the stock airbox so all that is needed is better flowing filters and if you want the silicon maf tubes. No silicon tubes and you are looking at a 1/3 of the cost of long tubes. __________________ 2010 LS3 C6 Silver coupe corvette

03-05-2010, 03:32 PM	#9 (permalink)
m4a1mustang A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Northern VA Posts: 55,385 Drives: on two wheels Rep Power: 6962	Again, your avatar is awesome. __________________ - Steve Zs & Coffee - Saturdays at 10AM in Fairfax, VA and Columbia, MD (Click the banner!) LIKE us on Facebook!

03-05-2010, 03:42 PM	#13 (permalink)
Caravanshaka I shake Caravans Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: north Dallas Posts: 9,517 Drives: everyone crazy Rep Power: 42	but, to do modshacks mod correctly, you need to resize the MAF tubes to "trick" the sensor into thinking less air is coming into the engine than really is, therefore leaning out your air/fuel ratio to produce a little more power. Keeping stock MAF tubes and smoothing the rest will yield a little more efficiency, but won't cause any change in the A/F ratio. __________________ ____________________ PROJECT DiaD - Sold but not forgotten! The first testicular guard, the "Cup," was used in Hockey in 1874 and the first helmet was used in 1974. That means it only took 100 years for men to realize that in order to work the penis, the brain must remain whole.

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