Over-Cooling Solutions
 

I was hoping to start a thread for all of us with oil coolers and live in colder climates. Who would ever think that over-cooling would be an issue...

Even with my Mocal thermostatic sandwich plate I am having trouble getting my oil temps to 180 degrees. This morning was especially cold (42 degrees) so I devised a simple, if not ugly, solution.

I took some painters tape and taped up the 2nd and 3rd grill. This worked well and it was much easier to get around 175 to 180 degrees on the way to work. I imagine i will have to tape up more of the front grill as it gets colder.

Keep in mind I copied ModShack's fang cold air intake. Those with the stock setting or any intake above the radiator might start choking the air intake to the motor.

you've just found One of the reasons the track cooler is not recommended for the street. More is not better (except under track conditions).

I noticed on a long road trip last weekend (60 degree temps) that even my standard sized cooler was running 175-180 degrees...

If you read about how the thermostatic plate works, you're pumping oil to the cooler all the time. It's the level of bypass that varies with the thermostat, but there is always bleed to the cooler. Make yourself a cover for a portion of the cooler to reduce it's efficiency.

(See page 5 for the final soluition to this issue)

Yeah, I am already devising a piece of sheet metal to place over the front of the oil cooler. I'll just remove it for track days.

And ModShack thanks for all the work that you do on this forum. Did you see my variation of the fang vent cold air intake?

What happened was that I forgot to order an extra set of flanges from aircraftspruce and needed to come up with a spur of the moment solution. I just massaged the 2.5 inch tubing and ran it straight into the air box.

That should work!

Thanks BTW...I saw your Mod.

I didn't pull those pass throughs out on mine because I lke to do mods that can be returned to stock with minimal time and effort. Regardless, the end results are the same. Hope it's working well for you!.....:tup:

I am hoping since I live in Arizona, I wont have this issue. Having the Stillen Race oil cooler installed tomorrow.

hahahahahahahah this thread is great. it's just great in every way. thanks for the post op. I live in socal and am seeing 240+ degrees normally. I sit in traffic quite a bit and i can literally feel a butt dyno of -20 hp from the heatsoak. I can only wish it was that cold but i guess that's why the grass is always greener on the other side.

Big oil cooler, Mocal thermostatic sandwich plate.

Outside Temp 50~55

Sixth gear on the highway 160 - 165. 170-175 fifth gear :driving:

"Heatsoak" in the context of oil-temps has almost nothing to do with power-output.

I'd love to see a mod for controlling oil-cooler airflow...something like metal venetian blinds in front of the cooler with a control stick that you turn coming up through a hole into the engine bay. It would be a sweet way to avoid having to pull off the front fascia to adjust it.

To ResIpsa, Why don't you tape the cooler instead of the front grill. the car will love you, and it will look nicer with out it.

Just an idea.

Bingo wtf

Sorry, I meant with out the blue tape. The one in front of the car.

Let me re write it.

"To ResIpsa, Why don't you tape the cooler instead of the front grill. the car will love you, and the car will look nicer with out the blue tape in front of the car.

Just an idea."


I was sleeping when i replied :shakes head:

Does it make since now?:ugh2:

Do you know of any tape that can withstand the heat?

I guess I could use a roll of header wrap.

I found a couple of tapes. Haven't try any of them, but they seem to withstand the heat.

Tape case

adlinsulflex

agismfg

Dontcha think taping is kinda ghetto? Just make a snap on metal shield that you can put on and off through the grill or the top.

Silicone tape used in powdercoating will take the heat though I'm reluctant to even mention it..

snap on metal shield is the best,clean way to do it. I was just giving him a cheep quick solution.

I am debating how I want to go about this. How much with the temp rise with a mocal 180 degree sandwich adapter? 1 guy in this thread said he was running the same temps as me with the mocal and I don't even have a thermo plate...insinuating to me that they do nothing, and I would be better off building a metal blocking plate. What should I do?

Hey I learned something! I always assumed they shut it off completely.

+1 rep :tiphat:

EDIT: meh, you are repped-out for now, rep'd you yesterday =:O

I agree with the snap on covers. diesel pick ups have problems like this in the real cold and alot of people will just JB Weld little snap pieces and get a tailor shop or someone to "fab" up a piece of wool or windstopper (look them up) it should help and make it alot nicer looking.

You are in AZ....Dunno how cold it gets there, but you may find if the temps dip below 50 degrees you might have a hard time bringing the oil up to temperature particularly at speed on the highway for any length of time.(this is where the Thermostat is advantageous)



:tiphat:

Had the oil cooler for w while now. Even if it is 70 degrees outside it takes the oil 30 minutes to reach 180 degrees. Generally the oil never gets above 170 degrees on my way to work in the mornings, and if it is really cool outside it will not pass 160 degrees.

I have the Stillen "race" oil cooler FYI.

I just want to know if shelling out $90 for the Mocal thermo plate will be a waste of $, if the temps wont change much or enough for it to be justified?

Yeah...The race cooler is too big....I'm sure the thermostat would help. I brought up these same concerns when Stillen announced the "Big" cooler with no upgrade on the plate...This is why they advertise it for Race applications. The cooler needs to be sized correctly....Even more important without thermostatic control....as you've found..

You could try one of these.
BAT, Inc. - MOCAL Oil Coolers
Remove the thermostat plate or leave it in, but with one of these you can solve your problem.

Yea, I brought it up with Stillen also and they said that in AZ I shouldn't have any issues getting the oil up to temp, even in the winter. Double edged sword cause if I got a regular sized oil cooler my temps would be too hot on the race track, lol.

Buddy of mine gave me a great idea yesterday. A valve you can flip closed or open Somewhere in line to the oil cooler. So when daily driving, you can have the valve closed and when at the track, just open the valve. Anything like this even exist?

The problem, as I understand it, is that you want some circulation in the oil on a regular basis. You don't just want a few quarts sitting up there for track days, not mixing with the other oil. That's why the thermostatic plates still allow small amounts of circulation even at low temps.

I'm going to try the shield, personally.

Very good point. I didn't think of that.

Maybe my link was misleading. What I was suggesting was the inline mocal thermostat. The inline, keeps the valving to the oil cooler completely closed until the preset temp is reached. That means your oil will warm to operating temps before the oil cooler would even come in to play. With the t-stat installed close to the cooler, the most you would have would be maybe a quart trapped in the cooler. I almost went this route when I installed mine, but we only have maybe a half dozen days below freezing down here and it is not my daily driver. So it was cheaper to buy the sandwich with the t-stat in it, since I needed a sandwich plate anyway. It just seems to me that putting on and taking off a metal plate depending on the temps outside would grow tiresome.

We undestood the link...The problem is, those outboard thermstats operate just like the Thermostatic plates and bleed oil to the coolr all the time as I described earlier. Digging a little further into BAT's website I found this description for the outboard types:

Flow diagrams on page 3 at the link: http://97.74.103.94/files/thermos$.p...t1=Get+Pricing

Oh well...Back to the drawing board!...

Oops. I stand corrected. Of course now that I see it won't work, I must find a solution(even tho I don't have that problem). It's a personal thing!!!

No Problem! Someone on another similar thread was looking into the Canton Thermostat/Bypass. No idea if it works like the Mocal or not. Spensive though at $180+

There is actually a very simple solution to all this:

Wolverine Engine Oil Heaters









:p

^You have to plug that in though, right?

Huh?.....I think the worry here is RUNNING temps, not STARTING temps..

(ah...Nebermind...A joke I see!....Missed the tongue guy)

Ok, Shot a note to Think automotive, they are the manufacturer of mocal and here is the response I received.

Harold,
Thanks for your email. The design of our standard thermo sandwich plate is such that in cold conditions you should not get any flow through the cooler. All though it is an open circuit it is far easier for the oil coming out of the engine to simply bypass through the centre of the stat and not to push a cold head of oil around the cooler. It may be in some instances that you are getting a small amount of circulation around the cooler but i would have thought this unlikely.
What makes you think the oil is currently going through the cooler?
I will give it some thought and if we have any ideas will let you know.
Regards
Matt

Matthew Potter
Think Automotive Ltd
Tel: 020 8568 1172
Fax: 020 8847 5338
E-mail: matt@thinkauto.com
Welcome to the home of Mocal oil coolers and components - Think Auto

Any further info I get from Matt I'll pass along. Maybe we can find out if people without an oil cooler are having the same over cool issues. I must admit this is the first car I have owned that came with an engine oil temp gauge, maybe we have all been running to cool at some point. Man, oil to hot , oil to cool, what is it with this car:rolleyes:

Apparently he does not know his product very well, or read the Mocal statement I posted above. I've installed 2 coolers with Mocal Thermostatic plates and they've both operated exactly as described in the Mocal statement (not this guys note).

As soon as you start the cold car you will feel heat begin to build at the cooler.

Updated the other thread.
http://www.the370z.com/nissan-370z-g...tallation.html

The Canton is supposed to be a complete bypass until 215. But at this point I take that with caution as who know's who they put in charge of answering emails.

Oh I believe you Modshack. When I installed mine and first started it, checking for leaks, it started to warm up even tho the temp gauge had not moved. I did not ask him how his unit worked, I was inquiring if they had or could make something with a 100% bypass. I was hoping that they could modify an inline t-stat, although now I am not sure I would believe him if he did!

Thanks Chris! Sorry I forgot who you were over there....So many freakin Oil threads it's impossible to keep up!.....:tup:

+1

Okay, I've been following this thread and I can't decide whether or not I need to be worried about this overcooling problem as it pertains to my individual situation, so I'd like some input/opinions from you guys. Let me explain my circumstances. I work from home full time. The only regular driving I do is to the gym 4 or 5 times a week at 5 in the morning. It takes me about 15 minutes to get there, and it takes about 13 minutes for my oil to get up to 180. So basically, I spend my whole drive getting my oil up to 180, then I shut down. Repeat when it's time to go home afterwards. Other than this, in the course of any given week I might make several quick runs to the grocery store or whatever, and the temps never get up to 180. Do I have anything to worry about? Is my engine at elevated risk for condensation and sludge formation due to what I've described above? Once in a while I'll need to go on an extended trip. Like last week I drove across town over to Forged to get my Uprev rom updated, which was a 45 mile trip each way on Interstates. Even then, my oil stayed mostly just a few degrees over 180. I think the max I saw was 210, and for only a brief period of time. FYI, I only got around to installing my cooler a few weeks ago, after seasonal temps already started to drop, so I have no summertime baseline. Any input would be appreciated.