No Brakes

MrZ · 08-11-2012, 04:51 PM

Put on my SS brake lines today bled the entire system and replaced the fluid with ate 200 clear. Bled the system once it was back together the pedal goes to the floor once I start the car. Rebled the system 3 times no avail what is wrong or did I do wrong?

Mitco39 · 08-11-2012, 09:19 PM

If it is anything like the trucks I am used to working on you need to activate the ABS to get all of the air out of that system as well.

spearfish25 · 08-11-2012, 11:26 PM

Did you pump the brakes a few times? It takes 4-5 pedal pumps to reseat the brake pads and pressurize the system. Otherwise, share your bleeding method so we can weigh in on potential problems.

chops · 08-11-2012, 11:31 PM

did you bleed BOTH valves? there are 2 valves on each caliper - front and rear. thats a total of 8 valves you need to bleed

MrZ · 08-12-2012, 12:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mitco39

If it is anything like the trucks I am used to working on you need to activate the ABS to get all of the air out of that system as well.

How do I activate the abs?

MrZ · 08-12-2012, 12:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spearfish25

Did you pump the brakes a few times? It takes 4-5 pedal pumps to reseat the brake pads and pressurize the system. Otherwise, share your bleeding method so we can weigh in on potential problems.

Before we took the lines off we bled the system dry cause i was switching the lines and fluid. The master cylinder went empty. When we bled the brakes we started with the rear passenger and went to driver rear then passenger front and finished with the driver front did it three times. When the car is off the pedal gets pressure. When i start the car there is no pressure in the pedal. I pump it and get nothing.we bled the master cylinder as well but to no avail.

MrZ · 08-12-2012, 12:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chops

did you bleed BOTH valves? there are 2 valves on each caliper - front and rear. thats a total of 8 valves you need to bleed

I only have one bleeder valve because i have the non sport brakes. Or are there 2 on the non sport as well?

ChrisSlicks · 08-12-2012, 01:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrZ

Before we took the lines off we bled the system dry cause i was switching the lines and fluid. The master cylinder went empty.

Oh oh, that is a really bad idea on an ABS equipped car. Never ever bleed the system dry as it allows air into parts of the system that you can't control like the ABS pump. Instead you should plug lines so that they retain fluid and keep air out.

Check for any leaks in the line fittings, if you don't find anything then it will have to be towed to a dealer so they can activate bleed mode on the ABS controller.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrZ

I only have one bleeder valve because i have the non sport brakes. Or are there 2 on the non sport as well?

No, there is only one per caliper on the base brakes.

Ubetit · 08-12-2012, 08:11 AM

You may have to bench bleed the MC

DCNISMO · 08-12-2012, 11:14 AM

Are you using a suction bleeder that uses vacuum to pull fluid through from the MC to caliper, or did you you use a pressure bleeder that pumps it back in from the caliper to the MC?
Or did you just pump them?

Go get a pressure bleeder or a vacuum bleeder. Get a good one, Snap-on
makes great ones.

wstar · 08-12-2012, 12:13 PM

I just use Speed Bleeders, makes one-man bleed pretty easy. That and a small bottle with a little plastic hose on it (that you see at every auto parts store). Various notes on the above:

1) Don't drain the system dry, always just flush new fluid in on top of the old. If you're worried about whether you got all the old stuff out, switch colors (ATE gold/blue) when you're doing a complete flush.
2) The manual says to disconnect the battery when bleeding. It doesn't make a lot of sense to me that this would make a diff, but I do it anyways, in case it keeps some part of the ABS from acting up somehow.
3) The bleed order in this car is right rear, left front, left rear, right front. I know it seems "wrong", but the manual probably lists it in that order for a reason (again, probably to do with ABS crap and/or how the pipes come together and their relative lengths).

Given where you're at, you're just going to have to work the system to get fluid back into everywhere it needs to be. Make sure it's filled and you've bled the obvious air out of the calipers. Turn the car on, and sit there in place pumping the pedal until either (a) it finally gets firm or (b) the fluid level gets low in the MC and you refill it and keep going. You might want to bleed the calipers again just in case once you get the pedal resisting a bit.

Then even after it seems bled and firm enough to be safe to drive on, you'll need to do some test driving and engage the ABS several times (as in, slam on the brakes and let it pulse) to spin up various passages it uses and get them filled (and the driving will help knock trapped air from the nooks in the calipers too). Then try topping off the MC and doing a little more bleeding. Eventually the system will get back to normal

.

When I've taken lines off (or calipers), I usually just put a ziplock bag hanging over the loose line while I work. You'll get some gravity bleed into the bag and a little air in the system, but it's just a few ounces. Just keep the MC topped up if you take a long time while the hose is hanging there in the bag.

Trips · 08-12-2012, 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisSlicks

Oh oh, that is a really bad idea on an ABS equipped car. Never ever bleed the system dry as it allows air into parts of the system that you can't control like the ABS pump. Instead you should plug lines so that they retain fluid and keep air out.

Check for any leaks in the line fittings, if you don't find anything then it will have to be towed to a dealer so they can activate bleed mode on the ABS controller.

No, there is only one per caliper on the base brakes.

Oh, I see your a Prem baby again

Quote:

Originally Posted by wstar

I just use Speed Bleeders, makes one-man bleed pretty easy. That and a small bottle with a little plastic hose on it (that you see at every auto parts store). Various notes on the above:

1) Don't drain the system dry, always just flush new fluid in on top of the old. If you're worried about whether you got all the old stuff out, switch colors (ATE gold/blue) when you're doing a complete flush.
2) The manual says to disconnect the battery when bleeding. It doesn't make a lot of sense to me that this would make a diff, but I do it anyways, in case it keeps some part of the ABS from acting up somehow.
3) The bleed order in this car is right rear, left front, left rear, right front. I know it seems "wrong", but the manual probably lists it in that order for a reason (again, probably to do with ABS crap and/or how the pipes come together and their relative lengths).

Given where you're at, you're just going to have to work the system to get fluid back into everywhere it needs to be. Make sure it's filled and you've bled the obvious air out of the calipers. Turn the car on, and sit there in place pumping the pedal until either (a) it finally gets firm or (b) the fluid level gets low in the MC and you refill it and keep going. You might want to bleed the calipers again just in case once you get the pedal resisting a bit.

Then even after it seems bled and firm enough to be safe to drive on, you'll need to do some test driving and engage the ABS several times (as in, slam on the brakes and let it pulse) to spin up various passages it uses and get them filled (and the driving will help knock trapped air from the nooks in the calipers too). Then try topping off the MC and doing a little more bleeding. Eventually the system will get back to normal

.

When I've taken lines off (or calipers), I usually just put a ziplock bag hanging over the loose line while I work. You'll get some gravity bleed into the bag and a little air in the system, but it's just a few ounces. Just keep the MC topped up if you take a long time while the hose is hanging there in the bag.

Great job of helping out guys

MrZ · 08-12-2012, 01:11 PM

Thanks guys for the advice that's why I come on this site. We are gonna try the power bleed the way the manual says and if that doesn't work I will be at Nissan first thing

MattP725 · 08-12-2012, 03:56 PM

You should be ok with a vaccuum bleed as reco'd... even if replacing all the brake components, you want to try avoiding running the system dry.

I use the super blue fluid just so I can see when it is totally changed.. much safer.

DCNISMO · 08-12-2012, 04:27 PM

I have a vacuum bleeder, used it for 15 years on all kinds of vehicles cars and bikes for brakes and clutch blessings. One of the best tools ever bought.

08-11-2012, 04:51 PM	#1 (permalink)
MrZ Base Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Jacksonville Nc Posts: 107 Drives: 09 370ZTouring CY AT Rep Power: 13	No Brakes Put on my SS brake lines today bled the entire system and replaced the fluid with ate 200 clear. Bled the system once it was back together the pedal goes to the floor once I start the car. Rebled the system 3 times no avail what is wrong or did I do wrong?

08-11-2012, 09:19 PM	#2 (permalink)
Mitco39 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Edmonton Alberta Canada Posts: 2,089 Drives: 40th 370z Rep Power: 132	If it is anything like the trucks I am used to working on you need to activate the ABS to get all of the air out of that system as well. __________________ 2007 Chevy Duramax - EFILive Tuned By Me 2010 40th W/ Nav - Boosted Performance - UpRev Tuned By Me The Mrs. Ride -2012 335XI N55 BMW - Cobb Tuned By Me, Built by her My Build --> http://www.the370z.com/members-370z-...39s-build.html

08-11-2012, 11:26 PM	#3 (permalink)
spearfish25 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Naples, FL Posts: 4,117 Drives: to work Rep Power: 1856	Did you pump the brakes a few times? It takes 4-5 pedal pumps to reseat the brake pads and pressurize the system. Otherwise, share your bleeding method so we can weigh in on potential problems. __________________ 2013 Cadillac V-Wagon, RIP Z

08-12-2012, 12:13 PM	#11 (permalink)
wstar A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 4,024 Drives: too slow Rep Power: 3594	I just use Speed Bleeders, makes one-man bleed pretty easy. That and a small bottle with a little plastic hose on it (that you see at every auto parts store). Various notes on the above: 1) Don't drain the system dry, always just flush new fluid in on top of the old. If you're worried about whether you got all the old stuff out, switch colors (ATE gold/blue) when you're doing a complete flush. 2) The manual says to disconnect the battery when bleeding. It doesn't make a lot of sense to me that this would make a diff, but I do it anyways, in case it keeps some part of the ABS from acting up somehow. 3) The bleed order in this car is right rear, left front, left rear, right front. I know it seems "wrong", but the manual probably lists it in that order for a reason (again, probably to do with ABS crap and/or how the pipes come together and their relative lengths). Given where you're at, you're just going to have to work the system to get fluid back into everywhere it needs to be. Make sure it's filled and you've bled the obvious air out of the calipers. Turn the car on, and sit there in place pumping the pedal until either (a) it finally gets firm or (b) the fluid level gets low in the MC and you refill it and keep going. You might want to bleed the calipers again just in case once you get the pedal resisting a bit. Then even after it seems bled and firm enough to be safe to drive on, you'll need to do some test driving and engage the ABS several times (as in, slam on the brakes and let it pulse) to spin up various passages it uses and get them filled (and the driving will help knock trapped air from the nooks in the calipers too). Then try topping off the MC and doing a little more bleeding. Eventually the system will get back to normal . When I've taken lines off (or calipers), I usually just put a ziplock bag hanging over the loose line while I work. You'll get some gravity bleed into the bag and a little air in the system, but it's just a few ounces. Just keep the MC topped up if you take a long time while the hose is hanging there in the bag. __________________ 7AT Track Car! Journal thread / Car setup details Last edited by wstar; 08-12-2012 at 12:16 PM.

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08-11-2012, 11:31 PM	#4 (permalink)
chops A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: NA Posts: 1,732 Drives: NA Rep Power: 22	did you bleed BOTH valves? there are 2 valves on each caliper - front and rear. thats a total of 8 valves you need to bleed

08-12-2012, 08:11 AM	#9 (permalink)
Ubetit Track Member Join Date: May 2012 Location: Ohio Posts: 527 Drives: the women lazy Rep Power: 14	You may have to bench bleed the MC

08-12-2012, 11:14 AM	#10 (permalink)
DCNISMO Track Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: washington dc Posts: 995 Drives: Nismo Z Rep Power: 179	Are you using a suction bleeder that uses vacuum to pull fluid through from the MC to caliper, or did you you use a pressure bleeder that pumps it back in from the caliper to the MC? Or did you just pump them? Go get a pressure bleeder or a vacuum bleeder. Get a good one, Snap-on makes great ones.

08-12-2012, 01:11 PM	#13 (permalink)
MrZ Base Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Jacksonville Nc Posts: 107 Drives: 09 370ZTouring CY AT Rep Power: 13	Thanks guys for the advice that's why I come on this site. We are gonna try the power bleed the way the manual says and if that doesn't work I will be at Nissan first thing

08-12-2012, 03:56 PM	#14 (permalink)
MattP725 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: May 2011 Location: Toms River, NJ Posts: 1,904 Drives: 2010 40th Rep Power: 17	You should be ok with a vaccuum bleed as reco'd... even if replacing all the brake components, you want to try avoiding running the system dry. I use the super blue fluid just so I can see when it is totally changed.. much safer.

08-12-2012, 04:27 PM	#15 (permalink)
DCNISMO Track Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: washington dc Posts: 995 Drives: Nismo Z Rep Power: 179	I have a vacuum bleeder, used it for 15 years on all kinds of vehicles cars and bikes for brakes and clutch blessings. One of the best tools ever bought.