one thing to take home from this is that bigger brakes are better, and tires with more grip are better, however the ability of the car to stop is limited
|
|
LinkBack | Thread Tools | Display Modes |
10-26-2010, 09:16 AM | #16 (permalink) |
A True Z Fanatic
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: NY
Age: 36
Posts: 9,192
Drives: Z32TT & 335xi Coupe
Rep Power: 37 |
one thing to take home from this is that bigger brakes are better, and tires with more grip are better, however the ability of the car to stop is limited whichever is the weak link. all things being equal, same tires, same car, same conditions etc, the car with bigger brakes is going to stop better. The ability of a car to stop is limited by a lot of things, tire compound is just one of them. weight of the car (even number of passengers affects the weight), speed at which it is traveling, road conditions (wet/dry, hot/cold). all things being equal, bigger brakes (assuming kits being compared are of equal quality) are going to stop the car better. end of story. if you want to put those brakes on a minivan going 100mph in the snow down a hill or on grandma's carolla going 20mph down main street, obviously they are going to perform differently, but that is because of other variables, not the brakes themselves.
|
10-26-2010, 02:33 PM | #17 (permalink) | |
A True Z Fanatic
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: window seat
Posts: 28,940
Drives: Mostly on two wheels
Rep Power: 120 |
Quote:
Besides the heat dissipation, bigger rotors allow for bigger calipers, with bigger components that are usually more easily modulated. |
|
10-26-2010, 04:48 PM | #18 (permalink) |
Base Member
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Augusta, GA
Posts: 129
Drives: '10 Conv A7 Blk Chry
Rep Power: 15 |
Wow, big discussion for one evening. I don't understand the sarcasm in the first 3 or 4 posts, I was asking a serious question. Just saying "duh, bigger brakes are better" doesn't tell me why which is what I was asking. The misspelling was just me not paying attention (I am a bad speller though). I maybe didn't ask the question in a clear enough way.
Taking our Z's as an example: I expect the larger sport brakes to stop the car from 60mph to 0mph in a shorter distance than the standard brakes (btw, I have not yet read any reviews testing the standard brakes, they all test sport packages). I know from experience that the standard brakes produce enough friction on the rotor to completely stop the tire from rotating making the tire skid over the pavement (or, well the ABS come on but you know what I mean). So, why do the larger sport brakes stop the car in a shorter distance? Yes, the sport brakes have a larger surface area in contact with the rotor and produce more friction but there is already enough friction with the standard brakes to lock up the wheels. The only answer I can gather (both from this discussion and my own imagination) is the larger brakes allow greater control over the stopping force allowing the driver to push the brakes closer to the point of locking up the wheel without crossing over the point where the tire starts to skid.
__________________
2010 Roadster, 7AT, Black Cherry, Touring, Navigation, Lighted Kick Plates, Floor and Trunk Mats. |
10-26-2010, 05:19 PM | #19 (permalink) | |
A True Z Fanatic
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: North East
Posts: 6,203
Drives: 09 370Z Sport M6
Rep Power: 653 |
Quote:
__________________
Hotchkis ARB | Stillen CAI | Art Pipes | Berk CBE | Stillen AP Racing Brakes | AE Performance Oil Cooler | BC Racing ER Coilovers | Doran Control Arms |
|
10-26-2010, 05:22 PM | #20 (permalink) | |
A True Z Fanatic
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: window seat
Posts: 28,940
Drives: Mostly on two wheels
Rep Power: 120 |
Quote:
I think heat is like 90% of the reason for the move to bigger brakes in most applications. Some people will find examples where that is not true, but the added absorption and dissipation area provides a huge benefit. I don't think that a comparison in stopping distance between base and sport would do much good, as they sport different size/weight rims, as well as different stock tires in notably different sizes. I believe that the stopping distance would likely be very close. I know I kept stock size brakes on my s2000, and despite the (relatively ) large rims I had on the thing, the stopping distance was in line with other s2k's sporting BBK's. On a track or in the twisties though, my rotors would heat up to the point where they were glowing red, while the rotors on said BBK's were still much cooler. Contrary to the belief many will have, for the contact between brake pads and the rotor, surface area is irrelevant. The reason that surface area plays a role in other situations (notably tires) is due to adhesion (pieces of the tire bond to the road). |
|
10-27-2010, 12:17 PM | #21 (permalink) | |
Base Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: SoCal
Posts: 135
Drives: Many
Rep Power: 235 |
Quote:
The big difference with a properly designed and built BBK is that you can do high-speed panic stops repeatedly without significant changes in stopping distance or pedal feel. While most people don't drive down the highway doing repeated 80-0mph braking, I've been though many a mountain pass when I didn't have enough brakes to keep them from fading. Some cars give you some warning before the pedal goes to the floor, but a few of them can give the driver quite an unwelcome surprise. It's not the pad surface area that creates the extra friction. However, a larger pad will run at lower temperatures, which is very good for it and the rotor. Lower pad temperatures mean easier pad selection, better modulation (for many compounds), lower chance of boiling the brake fluid, more consistent and repeatable performance and increased pad and rotor life. One of the added benefits of a BBK for regular street driving is the fantastic pedal feel. At least when you hit the off-ramp at speed to find that cars are back up around a blind curve, you know that you can bring the car down with confidence and control. Just keep an eye on those mirrors! Chris |
|
10-27-2010, 12:20 PM | #22 (permalink) | |
A True Z Fanatic
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Gold Coast CT
Posts: 10,599
Drives: 2019 Corvette G.S.
Rep Power: 43 |
Quote:
__________________
SOLD MY Z MARCH 2018 - another Core OG moves on - new ride 2019 Z Corvette Grand Sport - no mods necessary but already have eyes on HFC and intakes LOL IT NEVER ENDS. |
|
10-27-2010, 01:18 PM | #23 (permalink) |
A True Z Fanatic
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: North East
Posts: 6,203
Drives: 09 370Z Sport M6
Rep Power: 653 |
Not really. Chris - AP covered it pretty well. Braking is initially tire limited, as any modern car can exceed tire to road friction with rotor to pad friction. Tire is the weakest link. Once you take repeated stops into consideration then many other factors come into play, and that is where the quality after-market brakes show their strength in resisting fade, consistent pedal feel, and durability.
__________________
Hotchkis ARB | Stillen CAI | Art Pipes | Berk CBE | Stillen AP Racing Brakes | AE Performance Oil Cooler | BC Racing ER Coilovers | Doran Control Arms |
10-27-2010, 08:11 PM | #25 (permalink) |
The370Z.com Sponsor
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Loganville, GA
Posts: 5,944
Drives: 370z
Rep Power: 2186 |
And our Sport Brakes give you very little warning when they go! Before the BBK, I got a soft pedal in one turn and slowed it way down and coasted into the pits, and took about 100 yards to stop from 20mph.
__________________
NISSAN: 75 280Z / 86 300ZX GLL /87 Sentra SE / 03 350Z / 23 Z Porsche: 93 968 / 23 Macan GTS / 93 968 |
Bookmarks |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
Just a general question | sonic370 | Nissan 370Z General Discussions | 26 | 01-21-2011 07:35 PM |
General question about FI | axeman71 | Forced Induction | 13 | 10-21-2010 04:21 PM |
just a general little question | sonic370 | Nissan 370Z General Discussions | 25 | 08-29-2010 01:47 PM |
Question about the Z's seats for the bigger guys | STi 5 | Nissan 370Z General Discussions | 20 | 03-11-2010 03:33 PM |
General question??? | Xavier Raymond | Nissan 370Z General Discussions | 7 | 03-09-2009 05:08 AM |