BBK Comparison thread: Brembo vs. StopTech vs. AP Racing

[AP - Chris_B]

Originally Posted by battlewagon

yeah im not mad, i just hate statements like that because they are the same as people bashing products just because they dont cost a lot, such as wheels or even cars as a whole. and i know what AP is to the brake world, probably the best brakes on the planet given their history, though ive never used them or experienced them. i know when respect is due, and AP gets mine

and obviously id put a paycheck down because i think id win the bet and win my money back and then some

OK. I took his comment to mean that without a reputation of performing at the highest level, it is difficult to see how grandiose claims can be supported. And I agree. I've seen a variety of systems "survive" at the hands (and feet!) of an amateur during 5 lap time attack sessions, but failed miserably when put to a more serious test. Some didn't even last that long (C6 Z06). I have heard many massive failure stories from people who thought they were saving some money on brakes. They just had no idea they were going to be spending that saved cash and more on K-rail replacement, not to mention a car rebuild.

Anyone can easily claim a product performs to their satisfaction -- great! Now can a company make a product that performs to the satisfaction of the larger market, continually develop and introduce new products, have reproducible and repeatable set of of quality procedures, manage quality gates with suppliers, ship kits and replacement parts in a timely manner, deal with packaging and shipping companies, support their jobbers, provide high levels of customer service and stand behind their products with reasonable warranties? These are just some of the issues that are underestimated far too often by companies new to the market. Just getting a few of these wrong will be their ultimate downfall.

AP has over 90 years of total automotive experience. Brembo has over 40. Both have been tested and are continually tested in the most brutal environments possible by professionals who get paid to win (not save the car), much of it on live television with nowhere to hide. Alliance??? It's a reasonable question for anyone to ask. Reputations are earned, not claimed.

Chris

[bullitt5897]

Good point Chris. I believe Alliance is out here to earn a reputation for high quality and parts that perform no matter at what level they are used.

We all have to start somewhere just like AP and Brembo did 40 and 90 years ago.

[Mike]

Originally Posted by Josh@STILLEN

Other brands pop up all the time.. and unfortunately not always to the quality needed to perform when pushed.. Especially when the country of origin can come into play.

I agree, one just has to walk down the aisles at SEMA and AAPEX to see all the no name cheap caliper companies and the foreign manufacturers who will make your own brand for you on the cheap with no testing at all.

[Mike]

Originally Posted by Josh@STILLEN

Other brands pop up all the time.. and unfortunately not always to the quality needed to perform when pushed.. Especially when the country of origin can come into play.

I agree, one just has to walk down the aisles at SEMA and AAPEX to see all the no name cheap caliper companies and the foreign manufacturers who will make your own brand for you on the cheap with no testing at all.

I just powdercoated a set of calipers called WP Pro for a guy. These were the worst things I have ever seen. Machine screws holding a finishing plate around the tiny pistons and shrink wrap tubing to insulate the crossover tube!


Not knocking Alliance, I know nothing about them.

[AP - Chris_B]

Originally Posted by Mike

I agree, one just has to walk down the aisles at SEMA and AAPEX to see all the no name cheap caliper companies and the foreign manufacturers who will make your own brand for you on the cheap with no testing at all.

I just powdercoated a set of calipers called WP Pro for a guy. These were the worst things I have ever seen. Machine screws holding a finishing plate around the tiny pistons and shrink wrap tubing to insulate the crossover tube!

I see them every year as well. Now, due to the struggling economy, they are desperate enough to offer any tuner a 10 car set deal to get their own logo on the calipers right out of Taiwan or India. The Chinese just copy the big names logo and all! So now almost anyone can be in the "brake business" overnight. Let's just hope they are all keeping current on their product liability insurance payments...

[ChrisSlicks]

Originally Posted by Josh@STILLEN

Anyone going to the track looks at pedigree, and technology into the development of brake products.. much beyond the looks involved with a kit, which was Chris' original statement.

Thank you Josh, that was the general point I was trying to make. When you go to the track you want a company with reputation to stand behind you. Alliance is essentially unknown here in the US (seem to be from somewhere in Asia). Maybe they will be able to build a reputation at the track, and hopefully for them they do, but so far there isn't any reliable data other than a couple of enthusiasts doing a single track day. Much more data would be required before I would be willing to invest in such a critical component.

[bullitt5897]

Mike correct me if I am wrong but from my knowledge Alliance is an American based company.

[Equinox]

most companies we deal with are, but do they manufacture their products or simply engineer them?

[bullitt5897]

Equinox that would be a question for Mike. Maybe he can chime in on that question.

[ChrisSlicks]

Is Mike from Blackline Motorsports or somewhere else?

[Mike]

Blackline is the only reference I can find anywhere on the net about Alliance, and thats only on Z forums and a prelude forum.

I'm not the Mike in question.

[bullitt5897]

not the Mike that I am referring to.

Blackline is the exclusive distributor and reseller for all of alliance's products as far as I know and understand.After I talked with Mike their main focus was on the Nissan market with their brake kits. They however are looking to expand beyond Nissan in the future and can do one off kits for customers who want them.

[Xan]

I think if they start a brand they should do some better research on brand names.

Alliance Parts is a brand of Daimler Trucks North America LLC, a Daimler company.

And these guys make brake parts, but I don't think they make the brakes from this thread.

So I'm pretty sure there would be some infringement here.
It's confusing to say the least...

(for reference Alliance Brand Parts -- Truck Parts and Accessories)

[bullitt5897]

Xan the name of that company is ALLIANCE Parts... not Alliance.

I don't see any infringement there.

[Xan]

Bullitt5897, they are referred to as Alliance by everybody and they themselves refer to all parts as just Alliance. Look at their product line, they have "Alliance Brake Kits".
http://www.alliancebrandparts.com/_A...gAxleBrake.pdf

I don't know the Alliance in this thread (as I can't find any info on them), but if they want to build a strong own brand, I wouldn't have chosen a name that is so close to/the same as another company that makes brakes as well.

But more on topic, if someone can post up some more info on these brakes and the company, such as the origin and experience of the company and such, we can learn about them.