Akebonos not up to heavy track use!

370Zsteve · 10-26-2009, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sharif@Forged

CMP and TGP are two of the toughest tracks on brakes. They just eat up pads, rotors, and everything else. If your brakes hold up well at these two tracks, they will have no problem at Road Atlanta, VIR, Barber, Roebling...etc..etc.

There are only a handful of brake upgrades I would use on track, and Brembo and AP, and Stop Tech are three of them.

I forget where I had read it, but one of the car mags had mentioned the Akebonos replacing Brembos and pointing to the F1 deal as if that was a positive thing for the Z's brakes. Seems that's not the case at all, thanks for the info, Sharif.

Sharif@Forged · 10-27-2009, 12:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 370Zsteve

I forget where I had read it, but one of the car mags had mentioned the Akebonos replacing Brembos and pointing to the F1 deal as if that was a positive thing for the Z's brakes. Seems that's not the case at all, thanks for the info, Sharif.

Nissan switched to Akebonos from Brembos for one reason: Cost savings.

AP - Chris_B · 10-29-2009, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sharif@Forged

Nissan switched to Akebonos from Brembos for one reason: Cost savings.

Sharif, you are 100% correct yet again!

azndummie · 10-29-2009, 09:13 PM

hmm strange, i wonder if brake ducting would make a significant difference

ChrisSlicks · 10-29-2009, 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sharif@Forged

Nissan switched to Akebonos from Brembos for one reason: Cost savings.

Too true. Honestly I think the Nissan base model floating caliper works better than the Akebono setup, it just can't handle the it generates.

370Zsteve · 10-29-2009, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sharif@Forged

Nissan switched to Akebonos from Brembos for one reason: Cost savings.

ya, keepin' it under the magic $30k. All reviews are very positive though, for the street anyway. The stopping distances are very impressive, fade minimal, dunno what's not to like for street use, anyway. Let dem moddies buy dem Brembos!

ChrisSlicks · 10-29-2009, 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 370Zsteve

ya, keepin' it under the magic $30k. All reviews are very positive though, for the street anyway. The stopping distances are very impressive, fade minimal, dunno what's not to like for street use, anyway. Let dem moddies buy dem Brembos!

In repeated braking tests they start acting up on about the 4th or 5th run depending on ambient temperature. Not true brake fade, rather brake malfunction with ABS skip. Happens to me all the time at Auto-X, sucks b@lls.

spearfish25 · 10-29-2009, 09:28 PM

Can anyone come up with a design/engineering reason for these findings? How do Akebonos differ from the 'better' aftermarket options? What would cause ABS malfunction rather than the usual fade with repeated stops?

I was pretty impressed with my Akebonos during my track day last week, and I was routinely getting into the ABS by the end of the day.

370Zsteve · 10-29-2009, 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisSlicks

In repeated braking tests they start acting up on about the 4th or 5th run depending on ambient temperature. Not true brake fade, rather brake malfunction with ABS skip. Happens to me all the time at Auto-X, sucks b@lls.

sounds like it. Pity ABS can't be turned off. Hmm...or can it. Where are the electronics propellerheads when you need them.

ChrisSlicks · 10-29-2009, 09:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 370Zsteve

sounds like it. Pity ABS can't be turned off. Hmm...or can it. Where are the electronics propellerheads when you need them.

ABS can be turned off but not easily (plus it's really nice for Auto-X). The problem is that the fuse module covers multiple components, including power windows and VVEL. I was going to buy a new fuse module and hack it up to cut just the ABS fuse wire but I never got around to it.

ChrisSlicks · 10-29-2009, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spearfish25

Can anyone come up with a design/engineering reason for these findings? How do Akebonos differ from the 'better' aftermarket options? What would cause ABS malfunction rather than the usual fade with repeated stops?

I was pretty impressed with my Akebonos during my track day last week, and I was routinely getting into the ABS by the end of the day.

When you were "getting into the ABS" this was more than likely the malfunction we are talking about. You feel the ABS kick in, lose about 50% braking force for a second and then it decides to grip again. The hotter it gets the longer it cuts out for. The sad part is that it doesn't take particularly high rotor temperatures to get into this state. I don't think the calipers are solely to blame for the problem however people that have replaced their calipers have seen the problem go away.

Mike · 10-29-2009, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spearfish25

Can anyone come up with a design/engineering reason for these findings? How do Akebonos differ from the 'better' aftermarket options?

That is what puzzles me too. My powdercoating business centers around brake calipers and I have broken down and rebuilt just about every mainstream caliper out there, brembo, akebono, stoptech, AP, rotora, etc, and I can't visually see anything much different, other than having the fluid go from side to side internally rather than with a crossover tube, but I can't imagine that makes a huge difference, based on hydraulic principles. Then again, I'm no engineer either.

I do know that the massive brembo monoblocs work awesome on the track though!!!!!

WShade · 10-31-2009, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike

other than having the fluid go from side to side internally rather than with a crossover tube, but I can't imagine that makes a huge difference, based on hydraulic principles.

Maybe the external crossover tube can help to dissipate a little more heat. But not enough to really matter

import111 · 10-31-2009, 10:18 PM

Tracked the car today. Brakes where fine. No ABS issues at all.

iceman21_23 · 11-01-2009, 01:32 AM

yea i tracked the car on friday, no issues at all with brakes

10-29-2009, 09:28 PM	#38 (permalink)
spearfish25 A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Naples, FL Posts: 4,117 Drives: to work Rep Power: 1856	Can anyone come up with a design/engineering reason for these findings? How do Akebonos differ from the 'better' aftermarket options? What would cause ABS malfunction rather than the usual fade with repeated stops? I was pretty impressed with my Akebonos during my track day last week, and I was routinely getting into the ABS by the end of the day. __________________ 2013 Cadillac V-Wagon, RIP Z

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10-29-2009, 09:13 PM	#34 (permalink)
azndummie Base Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Irvine Posts: 7 Drives: nissans Rep Power: 16	hmm strange, i wonder if brake ducting would make a significant difference

10-31-2009, 10:18 PM	#44 (permalink)
import111 Track Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Tucson, AZ. Posts: 622 Drives: 09 Nissan 370Z Rep Power: 191	Tracked the car today. Brakes where fine. No ABS issues at all.

11-01-2009, 01:32 AM	#45 (permalink)
iceman21_23 Track Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: league city, tx Posts: 757 Drives: 09' Solid Red 370z Rep Power: 17	yea i tracked the car on friday, no issues at all with brakes