Tuning the Wicked Stage1 system to sound right

steveg78

I was going to add this to the magic box thread but I figured I'd start a new thread since this could get busy. Here's the system that I purchased from Wicked:

JL XD 500/3
Hertz ESK 165.5 components
JL 10WXv2

Purchased separately:
Pioneer Appradio 3 (SPH-DA210)
KnuKonceptz Complete 4 Gauge 4 Channel Amplifier Installation Kit
Dynamat Xtreme hatch/doors

Overall the system sounds good but I feel like something isn't rounding out the sound.

I've adjusted my gains for both the fronts and the sub using a DMM, all levels set to flat on the HU and no bass boost etc. The LPF on the amp was set to 80Hz. I set the HU volume to 75% (30 out of 40 on the HU), and played a 60hz tone for the sub test, 100hz for the doors.

For the components, I have the HPF on the amp set to OFF; is this correct since I have passive crossovers?

Also, I should mention that I installed the HD-RLC (remote level control for the sub). When I set my gains using the DMM, I had this turned all the way up.

Now my conclusion:

I'm not sure if I am expecting a lot more from this system or if something isn't tuned right. The 6.5s in the doors produce some pretty decent punchy bass. So much so that there really isn't a huge difference felt when I turn the sub down completely (using the remote knob). It seems like the sub bass is felt towards the very end of the clockwise rotation on the knob. For example, the knob ranges from 8:00 - 4:00, when I start at 8:00 (lowest) and turn it up, I don't start to hear the sub until around 2:00. And the difference between 2:00-4:00 is not much.

I'm trying to avoid using any EQ or boost settings on the HU to tune this system but it just seems like the sub isn't performing. Should I just use the EQ on the HU and reset the gains again? From what I've read, there seems to be a lot of purists out there who say that you shouldn't need to use any EQ/Boost settings on a HU if you set your gains and crossovers correctly. While I've had some booming systems 15+ yrs ago, I never measured and dialed sh*t in properly and thought that by doing it this way, I would get the best sound quality out of my system.

Any insight would be appreciated.

RonRizz

Leave your hpf for your components the way you have it. As for your Sub, try switching your lpf to 50Hz, set your bass remote knob to center position, and re-adjust your amp gain. This will give you the ability to increase OR decrease your bass level as needed.
As for your Head units EQ, Leave it at 0. Your eq will not add missing frequencies, no matter how hard you try. use your eq to CUT freq. that sound overbearing to you. This also reduces the chance of adding distortion.
Your MM readings should be 17.32 on fronts....34.6 on sub, Yes?
Lastly, Check your polarity.

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steveg78

Ok good, I am on the right track with the hpf up front and leaving the HU flat.
Polarity has been triple checked. I will try what you said about switching the lpf to 50hz and readjusting gain. However, my math gives me 26.83v as my target voltage for the sub.

180w x 4ohm=720
Sq. root =26.83v

Here's my DMM shots for the front 2ch and the sub:
EDIT: Added amp pic.

RonRizz

I thought the 500/3 did 300 watts to a 4 ohm sub??

__________________
P99rs Head Unit--- Amps- 2 Pioneer Prs800d --- Zapco ST1000MX---Zapco ST-4XSQ---- SI BM mk5 Subs---SI TM65v2 Midbass--- SI M3 mids--- SI M25 xbl2 tweeters ----- 2016 MECA street class 3rd place at world finals

RonRizz

Just did a quick googlage..... It is 180 @ 4ohm... 300 @ 2. You are correct, sir.

__________________
P99rs Head Unit--- Amps- 2 Pioneer Prs800d --- Zapco ST1000MX---Zapco ST-4XSQ---- SI BM mk5 Subs---SI TM65v2 Midbass--- SI M3 mids--- SI M25 xbl2 tweeters ----- 2016 MECA street class 3rd place at world finals

steveg78

OK good. I'm not losing it. Plus after re-reading the manual for the amp, JL includes the target voltage. I'll go an try what you said in about an hour and report back.

Thanks again!

bigaudiofanat

I will be back in NJ next week if you would like to get together and have me look over everything. Did you make sure your sub is getting the sub output of your head unit and sub is set to on?

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steveg78

Big thanks for the offer. If I remember correctly, the setting on the HU is set to sub and so is the preamp as well. I haven't had a chance to try what Ron suggested but will do tomorrow after work. If that doesn't work out, I might take you up on your offer since you're just over the bridge from me. Would be interested to see if I'm just expecting much more from this lil sub than it's capable of. Will report back tomorrow.

steveg78

Ok so just spent 4hrs checking every single wire and playing with this crap. When I set the lpf to 50hz, remote knob at half, I get NO VOLTAGE to the sub channels. Then I noticed I had the amp in 2ch mode instead of 4ch mode. The amp works in 2ch mode because it has the ability to take ch1&2 RCAs and combine them into a mono for the sub. However, I ran 2 sets of RCAs anyway. When I switch to 4ch mode sub is quiet. Checked the connections on the amp and I notice that the RCAs are loose as in they aren't snugging up nice n tight. I looked at them and they aren't bent or anything. Gently squeezed on them with a crimper to snug them up but no dice. I have to use the amp in 2ch mode to get anything to the sub. I'm beat from taking apart the dash another 3x. I know I should return the RCAs to knukonceptz but at this point I'm not looking forward to ripping everything apart again to get a set of working RCAs. What a frustrating night.

RonRizz

Don't let it get to ya brother!! you'll figger it out.

__________________
P99rs Head Unit--- Amps- 2 Pioneer Prs800d --- Zapco ST1000MX---Zapco ST-4XSQ---- SI BM mk5 Subs---SI TM65v2 Midbass--- SI M3 mids--- SI M25 xbl2 tweeters ----- 2016 MECA street class 3rd place at world finals

jaycz

I have a XD500/3. I have the switches set just like yours except I'm using my head unit for the HPF/LPF. Give it a try. Much easier to tune. My HU is a JVC KW-R900BT.

steveg78

Drove the car up to visit family 1.5hrs away. The sound quality actually got worse. Im definitely going to replace the RCAs and if that's not it, im thinking something with the amp could be defective.

steveg78

So on the drive back from visiting my family, I had plenty of time to think of "what could be wrong". When I tell you that right now my system sounds worse than the OEM non-bose, I'm not kidding.

When I got home I cranked the stereo to max (40) and used the DMM to test the voltage on the RCAs. Sure enough, 2v just like the specs on the HU say. I also put a brass brush bit in my dremel and took it down to a nice high gloss shine around the grounding nut. Tested the ground point with DMM and it's good (it was good before I took the dremel to it). Amp seems to be getting the proper signal, and putting out the expected power. The only other thing left is either the sub itself or the lamp cord that was used to connect to the inside of the terminals to the sub. I expected at least some decent gauge speaker wire in there? It looked to be soldered up well when I put the sub in there. I'm not sure if I want to go and take the speaker out and re-solder in some 12ga wire like I did for the rest of the car.

I just don't get it... The bass I am getting is barely noticeably different than what I'm getting out of the doors.

RonRizz

It sounds like you are checking everything you need to. Just a suggestion, take a step back, a deep breath, and go through all of the simple (as in operator error) type issues first. All settings in HU proper....check settings on amp..... Try disconnecting bass remote for any discernable difference.... ect ect ect.
Next comes your wiring. Methodically go over it from front to back. are all your RCAs correctly connected (channels 1,2, 3, and 4 match from HU to amp, ect. If all is well, see if you can get your hands on another amp (from a friend) and hook it up, see if it makes a difference.
Its hard to troubleshoot without being hands-on. I say give it another go, and if no good, take Big up on his offer, and save yourself some heartache.

__________________
P99rs Head Unit--- Amps- 2 Pioneer Prs800d --- Zapco ST1000MX---Zapco ST-4XSQ---- SI BM mk5 Subs---SI TM65v2 Midbass--- SI M3 mids--- SI M25 xbl2 tweeters ----- 2016 MECA street class 3rd place at world finals

steveg78

Thanks Ron, I am pretty sure everything is set right on the HU, and I even switched them around to see if there was any noticeable difference. I tried disconnecting the bass remote knob thinking that thing could be messed up and still same result RCAs are labeled since I used the remote line that is integrated with the RCAs... I labeled one set "R" for "rear" and "remote"... Simple and idiot proof to avoid problems hahaha. Friday night I took apart the dash and pulled the HU again and re-soldered and verified all connections. I might have to take Big up on the offer just to get another set of good eyes on it. I'm a DIYer and can usually get the job done but this has me stumped.

Like I said, I've done installs before when I was a young punk and they sounded better than this and were definitely done a hell of a lot messier, i.e. twist the ole wires and wrap em in electrical tape! Never had components and just supplied as much power as I could to everything!