sound deadening review and stickied?

YzGyz

I been researching sound deadening material and can to the conclusion to Second Skin on my Nismo's cabin floor and trunk.

Anyhoo, sound deadening your car and the type and material used belongs in this Audio/Vid section. A good sound system is only as good and the environment that it is used in. You can't have good music in the middle of a busy shopping mall. You need to isolate as much "noise" from the sound/music that you want to listen to.

So to those that have used these type of materials, please post up a quick review of the following to help people learn/decide what is what and how good it is.

1.what you use
2.where you used it (include car type, door, trunk, cabin, ect.)
3.how was the application (easy to roll, flexible, heavy, sticks well, ect.)
4.how much you used (x amount for trunk, x amount for door, ect.)
5.how effective it was at isolating external noise
6.how long it take to do the job
7.would you do it again
8.how much did it cost (give estimated date of purchase to try)
9.any additional comments about your install or about the material

bigaudiofanat

Honestly In my years of using different brands the best I have found was second skin which was the thickest and best bang for the buck. However they are all pretty even otherwise your mostly paying for the brands anymore. IMO

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RonRizz

I Agree 100% after all, its basically about adding mass.
H20 Doc, believe me when I tell you that more is better in this case. although not the most scientific of studies, In my prior car, I tested dbs of road noise first with no mat, again with a single layer, and finally with 2 layers. The difference was great from 0 to 1. Although not that significant from 1 to 2, it definitely improved.

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H2O_Doc

I have used Dynamat, Edead, and Rattle Trap. All effective. Rattle Trap a bargain, but does have that roofing odor. Of course, I use roof tar under my arms to give me that working man smell I can't obtain in my current position. Dynamat is too expensive at retail prices for me. I have a friend in the aftermarket armor proofing of cars; they use EDead between plates of armor proofing stuff and he always has some laying around for when I change cars. It is a bit thin but easy to work with. Works great on the cat, too.

I THINK that maybe the way some people use it is overkill; covering every square inch of a panel. I've used smaller portions on one door versus the same door with a fully covered door on the same car, and wasn't sure thee was a difference. Big would know much better than I.

Rockhound

That's probably because most of these products mentioned are just the dampening layer. I found that out the hard way in a previous car. Loading up on a dampener material is going to be disappointing as it is just one of three layers needed to cut down sound waves.

A three layer approach is the most effective at sound deadening; you need a dampening material first, which is what almost every 'dynamat-esque' product is. This layer primarily reduces panel resonance, but lacks the mass to effectively reduce noise, it's just the physics of sound propagation - and a little goes a long way. Second you need a buffer layer of closed cell foam. On top of that you need a barrier of something with some heft, like mass loaded vinyl - this is a crucial layer for significant reduction.

I did tons of research on this stuff anticipating needing it in my Z that was on order, but after owning it a year I've been fine with the noise levels. One helpful website I found for this stuff is Sound Deadener Showdown - this guy has put together a fantastic breakdown of each layer and the reasoning behind it.

http://www.sounddeadenershowdown.com/


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DrNumbers

While this website was an interesting read, I feel like it's a bit misleading at times and ends up being misinterpreted. This guy says that 25% is the optimal coverage for CLD tiles, but I think many people end up covering 25% with other types of products (i.e. dynamat, noico, gtmat) which are more akin to the CLD sheets that he sells. In fact, he notes that more CLD sheet is needed to match the performance of CLD tiles. How much coverage though is not stated, as his CLD sheets are meant for 100% coverage to protect from corrosion.

He doesn't show any test to say that 25% coverage is optimal. I watched the video on youtube, and pinging a steel sheet with and without CLD tile is not a real test. All he showed is that 25% coverage does something. I will say that the difference was impressive, but still nothing to back up the claim of 25% coverage being optimal.

I think the other thing is that his website is really focused on blocking sound as opposed to vibration/rattles. In that regard, I agree that layering sound deadener to reduce sound is not effective. I'm curious as to how well 25% coverage would reduce door/hatch rattles in the 370z resulting from mid-bass or subs hitting. I'm not convinced that using high coverage of dynamat/noico/gtmat is useless for mitigating rattles. There are certainly diminishing returns though.

This begs the question - Optimal for what? Is cost effectiveness part of that equation? If we don't care about cost, and our goal is for example, elimination of sub rattles, I think that optimal point changes. Maybe we don't need 100% coverage or double layering, but I think there's a reason most SQ/SPL competitors go heavy on the coverage besides being misinformed. Ultimately, I think going 25% coverage with most sound deadeners is not going to be very effective in reducing rattles. There was a clear difference in tapping on my doors with low coverage and high coverage.

All in all, still some good info in there, but I've seen a lot of people (on audio forums) misinterpret what is actually being said.

markesc

Agreed.

I'm going to just take the experimental approach, not like one cannot remove the door panels again and try something different/add later.

Just saw on this channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/CarAudioFabrication/videos

this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3EXuHlBy4M

Looks like he uses different layers of different types, and custom plastic panels to cover the window service area opening, while still allowing them to be unscrewed/removed if the window ever needs replaced. Top notch work! (great excuse to buy all kinds of tools).

Off topic, but I read somewhere people complaining about the bose system, here is an Audio Control amp that is in my opinion future proof for any vehicle moving forward if you want to keep the stock deck. NO remote turn on wire needed and you get an extra set of line outs for future sub amp add ons: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=flz6sq1dCuk&t=4s They also have a dsp that's just sweet!

The idea is it eliminates the need for a line/level converter, as everything is built into the amp. An INSANE amount of flexibility. Probably going to be the way everyone will have to go in the future with this hobby as oems come up with new ways to over complicate things and give us bs we don't need/want.

I found this helpful as well: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=308ueFVOylU

markesc

wow 15 sq feet GTMAT Quadro Pro didn't go very far!!!

Upon advice from others, decided to tackle the rear trunk area first.

Before:



After:



Did whole sheets around the shock towers in hopes that it will reduce some of the freakin tire noise! Also did the back section not seen in the photos, but I'm positive that's where a lot of the exhaust noise comes from. Instead of doing the blanket cosmetic approach, I tried this time by focusing on areas that actually needed it as it's not a Ferrari/Bugatti/etc.

What shocked me most was just banging around and realizing that there are so many areas where it's simply tinny metal!!!!

So far I can tell an immediate difference just re-parking the car back into the garage!

Question:

I noticed there's a gap in the fender area that you can fit your hand in quite a ways on the drivers side, and not so much on the passenger side. Has anyone tried any sort of expanding foam sound deadener in these two particular places?

Will order some more and not sure if I should do that small area where people put their aftermarket amps, or if the doors would should take priority?

Appreciate everyone advice on this! I'm late to the party however, 3.5 years of ownership and just now doing this...

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cv129

^rather new to this, very interesting read for a rookie like me. I found the sound test and the use of Velcro quite eye opening.

RonRizz

Great link, Rockhound. A definite must read for the enthusiast.

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H2O_Doc

You might well be right, but my point is more about whether or not you need edge to edge coverage versus strategically placed material. If you are trying to keep a sheet of metal from flexing or vibrating (and thereby transmitting sound) then you might not need material near the edges (think about striking a drum in the middle versus the edge). Greater thickness will certainly increase the dampening, but I'm not sure you need material where the sheet metal is already pretty stiff.

bigaudiofanat

I've done entire vehicle's and only certain panels. You may get slightly less noise doing an entire car with a rubber backing sound mat. There are other salutions such as foam which absorb sound much better than sound mat. What I am saying is the mat does give you a layer of quieting your cabin down but mostly it's used for vibration control for panels as you said, that flex and rattle. Given that I would only do door panels , wheel wells in trunk and possibly the trunk as well.

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RonRizz

I follow what you are getting at, and I'm sure you are right about that, But the tricky part may be figuring out how close from the edge to stop your mat and still be able to control the resonant frequencies you are looking to contain. That in itself could be a very tricky proposition, and would certainly take more research than I would be willing to put into it. I would say, since panels are off, and mat is in hand, go 100% and leave no question.

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Rockhound

Just to be clear, foams generally make very poor acoustic barriers as they lack a key property: mass.

Closed cell foam (used as it won't absorb fluids) is used mainly as a decoupler layer between the dampener and the stuff that actually exhibits the physical properties necessary to knock down sound waves: mass loaded vinyl.


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Pintsize725

You want GTMAT QUADRO. /thread

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