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Originally Posted by Chuck33079
Ricer, the only issue with the cars you compare it against is that they all sell 10x times what a Z does. They sell hundreds of thousands of Miata, mustangs and camaros. The frs uses the same off the shelf Aisin tranny that toyotas used in other cars. The German cars have a higher margin on them, so you can absorb the costs easier. It's easy to amortize a bunch of different options when you sell like that. When you move 5k units a year, we're lucky they didn't completely kill it again.
Not to mention, Porsche has been moving away from manuals for a while now, Benz doesn't have one and bmw has only a very few models available. Only the Vette in your list is really easily available with a stick. It's sad, but that's the way the world seems to be going.
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We do agree that the trend going forward is automatics for the masses, but I stand behind my point that certain segments can afford to keep them for a while longer. The recent debut of the Porsche 911 R reinforces that - if they were truly dedicated in dumping the manual altogether, why did they build this car?
Also - the Aisin transmission you mention is now exclusively used in the FRS/BRZ. The Lexus has dumped it as an option altogether. I'm not aware of another vehicle that uses it in the Toyota/Lexus lineup.
You mention margins - the current Z still shares a platform with the Q50 and upcoming Q60, and it's highly unlikely the next Z goes to something else. They can stand to slightly retool the 370Z's existing manual and pair it with the VR30DETT, especially when the sales of the Q50 are continually increasing to make up for any costs you incur customizing its platform enough to extend it to another product like the Z.
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Originally Posted by MagicBus
Ricer, In your above example of the Miata, yes it still has a manual trans but that's because they're using the same trans as always. No need to retool the factory to do this, kind of like the current Z, keeping the manual trans adds no additional cost to keep it in the line up.
Regarding the BRZ, that's not a singular trans for a singular vehicle. FRS also uses it and I'm sure it came from some other Subaru model.
As Chuck has also mentioned above, the Z is in a very small market. Then add to the fact that the manual trans driver is a niche buyer in this small market, and it won't make sense to build it, especially for a $$ guy like Carlos Ghosn.
Also keep in mind, Nissan's ultimate sports car, the GTR came out with no manual trans. While I would love to be wrong and have Nissan come out with a 400hp manual trans Z. I'm not going to hold out for this.
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First - name another Mazda that uses the Miata's transmission. Also - the transmission was reworked fairly extensively with the new Miata for a couple reasons - the SkyActiv motor is completely different, and the target with this car was weight savings. Even then, the cost is justified. Sure they have sales numbers behind them, but only a goofy Fiat shares a platform with the Miata now, and that's the first time that has happened. The 350Z forward always had a platform partner to help the business end of things work.
Second - as I mentioned above, the FRS/BRZ is now the singular user of said transmission. At one point, 60% of those sales were manual transmissions. I would say the cost of producing that transmission is more than justified.
Third - yes Ghosn is a money guy... a money guy smart enough to know that you don't toss a product into the mix of other products you're competing with that's short on offerings, especially when those offerings may push potential buyers to the competition. We have plenty of 7AT lovers here, but how many guys would have explored their options a bit more extensively if a 6MT wasn't offered in the Z? Sure the Z is getting outsold by those cars, but I can't imagine offering a manual hurt the numbers.
Finally - the GT-R was meant to be the bleeding edge performance marque for Nissan. To slightly oversimplify, currently, bleeding edge speed means dual clutch automated transmissions. The transmission of the GT-R is mounted in the rear of the vehicle for various reasons, but the main one would be weight distribution. A manual transmission absolutely does not fit the mantra of this car. The GR6 is massively expensive to produce. I believe OEM replacement assemblies hover around $20k. If you were designing a car to be the fastest thing possibly obtained for under $80k (at release), and its transmission was one of the main facilitators to that goal, would you spend time engineering another transmission that would have to be designed unlike anything you've ever designed, and in the end, it would severely inhibit the performance goals of the car? Sure many of us would have loved a manual in this car. However, even beyond the business case, a manual tranny didn't make sense for the R35 on so many levels, and it's really not a good example of a counterpoint, especially when you're comparing its situation to a car that costs 30%. It's like asking why the upcoming Ford GT doesn't have the same powertrain options as an EcoBoost Mustang.