Quote:
Originally Posted by triso07
No you're right Ricer we should just accept our new crossover overlords ... because business case.
Not really sure how I'm "all over the place". I just don't think you like that I disagree with you.
|
I have people respectfully disagree with me everyday, but at least they can articulate a coherent point in doing so. It's not just that we disagree, it's that the "point" you're making in your previous posts isn't rooted in reality whatsoever. However, now that you're taking more time to articulate yourself, it's getting much better.
In order to accurately speculate as to what Nissan will do with this thing, you have to understand how Nissan is going to approach this from a business case because they're currently in love with their billions in profits. They have to build the next Z to make money, or they won't build it, and how they start is how cost-effective it will be for them to design and produce.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by triso07
As for Camaro and Mustang, I don't believe anywhere in my post I referred to them losing weight and gaining power. I was referring to the multiple levels of trim offered by Ford and Chevy for their muscle cars. You're kind of shooting yourself in the foot with this one though since the new Camaro is losing weight and adding power lol. By the way Ford and Chevy are listening to their target audience and building cars those people want to buy, which is why they are selling so successfully. Can you say the same for Nissan and the Z?
|
Ok the Camaro is losing weight and adding power for the first time in its history. I overlooked that to my detriment. However, the Mustang gained weight and not much power to offset it. So perhaps you're also shooting yourself in the foot by leaving that out of your rebuttal?
Let's focus on this reality, however, which still reinforces my original point - Chevy is doing this on the Alpha platform that is shared across three vehicles with more in the pipeline (CTS, ATS, and Camaro with future vehicles being considered, and these are all volume cars!) This helps them create more profit and in turn increase flexibility. The Mustang does not yet share its platform with anyone, but it's a long established VOLUME car that Ford can afford to do more with, and it's consistently the #1 or #2 seller in its segment. What does Nissan have that they can create this type of scenario with? If they're going to downsize, they can't share a platform with the Q50. If they're going to stay the same, then it looks like they would continue using the FM platform that is currently the G/Z, but with the G/Q40 being done after this year, that's not even cost effective anymore, so that's very unlikely.
The Z isn't a volume car, and as such, it won't get volume R&D dollars to create "optimum design scenarios" unless it streamlines with some other strategy Nissan has not yet revealed.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by triso07
As for the motor. They won't make one specifically for this car is the appropriate wording. A turbo 6 pulled from the Q50 would be fine, even if it's heavier. However that turbo 6 will need to make some solid power. They can't throw it in with 350hp especially if there's a weight gain. If Nissan can't lose some weight on the Z then it needs to make up for that in power levels. Something has to give on one end or the other to pull some more performance out of the car.
|
Hey! We agree here. But what about for the other two motors you think they should have available a la pony cars? Where would those come from?
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by triso07
Nissan needs to decide what the Z is.
|
We also agree here.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by triso07
Is it a budget Cayman sports car? If so slightly lighter weight, a little more power, and some modernizing will do it.
|
Many would argue that it already is in 370Z form, including myself, but Nissan has already indicated that it won't go this direction for the next gen.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by triso07
Is it a budget sporty performance coupe that competes with Americas big 3? If it is, then weight can stay right were it is, throw a turbo motor in, and bump power enough so that performance is on par with the muscle cars.
|
We also agree here. You are showing great improvement.
Quote:
|
I certainly don't view it as a BRZ/Genesis/Miata competitor, but if they do then god help us.
|
Many, including some of the longtime Nissan guys that were around when the 240Z came out, would disagree with you here. Today's definition of "affordable sports car" is different than what it was in the 70s when there was less competition, less diversity in the market, and less money to be thrown around for cars from prospective buyers.
So I proposed to you this - would a car that's 2800lbs-ish with a 250hp/250tq-ish turbo 4 on a solid platform that costs around $27k really be such a bad thing?