Gauge

I would think 30 would be the price I would aim towards. How I got my under invoice price was haggling him down and then when I felt he was done I said I'd have to think about it. A few hours later and he offered me the under invoice price and I told him sold.

Also don't hesitate to make dealers price bid. I started out with 3 dealers pricing each other down. It feels dirty but it's your money, and if they want it they should compete.

I did my search in 100 mile area because that to me justified the price savings. A 100 mile drive is easilly worth the several hundred to a thousand cheaper you can get a car by surfing multiple dealers.

But as the former poster says, I feel that 250 over invoice is fair. Everyone wins that that price.

Also tru car is your friend. The people who sell on trucar are what is called "internet managers" that's just a fancy way to say that they also sell to clients online as well as on the floor. These internet managers have a higher throughput of cars monthly than just floor sellers, and in fact the internet manager I talked to says MOST of his traffic is through internet dealings. So they can offer lower prices because they have a higher throughput.

Hope this helps